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Episode 02
Collective wealth

Turning Black Tax into Black Capital

A practical conversation on family support, shared responsibility, and building wealth without burning out.

01:09:19 Collective wealth Open on X
Open full transcript

Hello everyone and welcome to another 9-jah native and today we have the respecial guest we have if I enter kudi who is a curator of Babujah global shaypas and Solomon Okongko who is the lead TSI BMC alternative bank And only a module who is the International and Patent

and Community Engagement Lead at the Boudelitor Society. So I'm going to give them the floor to say hello. And we're going to start with if I'm, if I'm just a hello.

Hi, Eda. Good afternoon. Good afternoon, everyone. Happy to be here.

Hi, Solomon. Can you say hello? Hi, hello, good afternoon. We're going to have a few years.

Not your work as a. Happy work. Thank you. Thank you.

Hello, Provost. And you're mad at you looking forward to the conversation today. All right. So thank you all for joining us.

We had a bit of a technical issue. We had a bit of a technical issue, which delayed some time, which got a bit of a delay. So we're going to get right into it.

So the first thing I would like to say is happy work is day and thank you all for joining. But then the first thing I would always do with this space is to first hear what our panelists have to say about what he means to be a non-gen native. So I'm going to go ladies first and give the mic to Oi Nie to tell us in her own awards where she thinks a non-gen native is. So we have this thinking of what a non-genetic is.

And if I'm looking at the Aspartav, see a non-genetic is someone who embodies the character of Nigeria and that is the product of the belief that you can do anything and especially for Jennifer's.

All right, nice one. Thank you for saying that. I'm so so long, mine. And you're on what's a non-genetic.

Fantastic and generative is one will import the discovery that can do specific that prison to price that bill everything possible The poor use of this building supports rather the person that is inspiring some building I'll be able to give that everything can be split by greater users or

And I can think to this as well, so we believe that Nigeria has the Nigeria spirit. This Nigeria, South Nigeria, almost Nigeria, and believe that we can have a great under the country as well. I think you're well, that was not an interesting thing. So, although it's so defined the curator of the global shape as,

And you have to be here today, but he looks very much like a Euroba man. That's what we'll ask you. What do you have to say? Okay, I think we don't have the same idea because I was going to say the same thing.

I think in my journey to... It's one who embodies the... The Hosel spirit of Nigeria, that thing that makes you go for the top,

You move into somewhere you're willing to do all it takes to lead, you're willing to do all it takes to succeed, you're willing to do all it takes to come out high-flight. So I think that that's very to go above and beyond to work and work hard enough to do the best of what you do. I think it's something that undeniably after I just named you, it's thank you.

And I saw a very interesting take. I personally like one of these questions in a step to drop right. And that's interesting because our last take was the job in the years that explore women's role in their economy.

But today's team is centered around turning black tax into black capital. And just looking at this, I'm just looking at the models. how unique are the possibilities for this to be

the model for collective wealth. And that's why interestingly we also have some and from our PSI joining us that's so long on. So I know a lot of

the endurance and black and general are very familiar with the concept of a black tax. And this is an opportunity for listeners to also timing and share their questions

where we have three well-versed and proud Nigerians here to offer the attack on how black facts can be black or tell and even just dive into how it could be a model for collective world. So get into it. And one of the interesting questions we have

here is what exactly is black facts and who pays it in Nigeria today. I'm going to give you a fine floor to buy them to this. What is black tax? I think we are a very conversant with this and it's usually

supports that you provide to friends families that often is something that reaches the gap of an this is for a non-existent welfare system in the countries that we come from, of course, here in Nigeria. So you have the Argent 2K request that you get, request for educational support,

request for supported medical bills, request for support with, you know, living expenses, whatever it is that family requires, whatever it is that friends require. So it's just the general support that we provide that is usually on structured. to the people around us.

And of course there is some negative connotation around it. I'm not sure. Of course it's a burden because most times the people who be at the cost or who bear this black tax are people who,

of course, are just breaking into wealth or they're breaking into financial freedom. You start making some leeway financial and then the whole family or the whole society starts to plan around your

So, for any reason, at the exact moment where you should be accumulating capital, at the exact moment where you should be trying to get ahead. But I think that the problem with black taxes is not essentially

to me, not essentially, that it exists. It's just the manner at which we do it at the moment. And maybe the cross of this conversation today is about rethinking how we structure what we call black tax.

I can go on and on, but I think just to answer your question, And Black Tax is whatever support that we provide to our immediate family, to our friends, to our communities. That to me is only occasioned by a missing welfare system within the Nigerian state.

And the people who bear it the most. Of course, in some societies we have the first bond. If you're the first bond son or daughter, it is expected that you take up from where your parents stop and support your your your loved ones or support your family.

In most cases, it's the passing who ends the most. If you look like the shining star, you better shine. You will support the rest if you're any more. And sometimes it's also based on who picks the form.

If you your card and you pick, you you would give, you find that it was family's a most of the site is the people who don't pick the form. you call it. I call me a thousand times. I don't know if you can call me. Maybe somebody brice, if I say who speaks the person who is available is oftentimes the person who

bears this constant most. I'll leave you here for now. I think if I have echoed most people's sentiments in terms of black tax but only it has a very curious look on her face so I'm going to give her a chance to respond to this and I'm just, you know, like, you know, inside of the store, what black tattoo.

So, what is there in the kitchen and in black tattoo? We cannot do it. We put the money that the community sees black. So, that reflects me to African communities.

But then the concept itself of giving support to family tends to target communities that are very collective. Because I was looking at it and I found out that also communities in Asia and also communities in Latin America also have this concept of support to family because this is a

community that has a lot of strong attachment to the community as a whole. So this is where as a, if I said wherever has the financial backing, the half family, where the picks of the call is kind of like seen as the person to help the family. So as, if I said this when there is no we're facing them because we're facing heat, we're

black, it is that object 20K. For more than that, it is that object hospital view. It is the object's proof is that our gents try to help the family group pass survivor mood.

So black tax, we need most of the cedar survivor. So when families need to pass that state where we are no longer looking at the aspect of how do we speed, how to need our college set to start market fast structure in the family.

And how did we even pass that stage? Then people started looking at who in the family can help because of how family is structured. Yeah, in Africa, particularly in Nigeria. It's your one name as we see anybody that will help you.

Or your father or your siblings. Or your family that will be the person to bring out what you need to get to the next stage. But then if you When we look at it that way, like you said, and you say, oh, I saw putting this, where does this stop being?

Is source of resource drain to the person giving this support to family? Because a lot of the time when you see this level of black task you're seeing between families that are trying to get

to even first generation world. Whenever we're talking about such a conditioner. And then this person is just building the first generation out and the mechanism they are meant to put in place is not being dragged as that source of money.

So that's where people's debt's politician of tax comes in because it is no longer something that you see that you are giving freely. Is that something that is now brought up for you? Like the government act that you don't have to do as like an obliquely gaitry source of supports to wherever you decide into supports. This brings me to the question, even to the audience,

like if you think about it, if you are working professional listening to this, what was the first time that you realized that your salary is my own. It was for me. It was the first salary I received. Well, just pass it on. That was, wow, yes. That was a lot of the balance. And I think like I just know in a lot of all the people's I'm gonna be talking about the month.

I'm on blah, blah, blah. All right, so. Why were they in the foundation for the meaning of, you know, a lot of the bins?

I'm going to give, I'm going to pass the mic to Solarman to tell us what is corporate social investment. So we can leave the foundation of some of the gens, we're going to be exploring in today's conversation.

So Solarman, over to you. All right, hi there. I think thank you so much. If honey and warning us really the very founding of this conversation, I would be very excited to know that we are a year with the two cash flow. Blackbacks, right, we have to make a most production, right? If I not made a very good

uh, very fragile point here, that Blackbacks is fundamental, uh, uh, fundamentally an And in from our social protection system, operating the expense of a remote state within another way to.

And if you look at it, we have to speak of laptops as a pedographer success. As a people look at it as some, you know, like conversation around that.

But the question is, I don't lead me to what compensation investment is all about. From your question is, what if it is actually the seed-carpitar that is needed for those family,

including family liberation, and collaboration, but it's all structured. And that is the actual why what the purpose of joining this make is all about.

So the corporate challenge of estimate as a name implies is the investment, the capital that is deployed in principle, right? Like we think the black types is non-negotiable.

some civil law people don't see law in the relationship, but yet the CSI is the capital that is deployed intentionally and create major law outcomes. Some of the companies kill

but they're gonna convey the other thing. And from the on the activity, right? And CSI rules beyond charity is a disciplined approach to solving super-corb.

And what we are trying to do is that from CSI, we are trying to invest in resilience, in inclusion, in livelihood and long-term prosperity.

And what's the plan to do so the world of social responsibility? Yeah, so corporate responsibility is botan-patios. But what is activity led?

Why do all the one, the corporate-professional investment that we also own from title two and what we're doing in alternative, but is impact focus, impact also led, right?

Is impact led? So when CSR will be accessing you, oh, what can we give back right now? What can we do on this activation?

What CSR is looking at is, what system can we help you? And that is what we do with the CSR is using the data, yes. And like I said, it's important, what is called access to the lab.

Why CSR is more strategic and more investment-based? So what CSR does, like focus on long term, social outcomes that can solve the black task issues that we have. It's a focus on measurable impact,

if it's on platforms and also sustainability. Let me give you a simple, you know, illustration. You can be looking at a CSR routine,

then you need some food packs at Christmas. What's the exercise with look-up? Why do some casuets, right? Which would pass every Christmas or every festival period?

And then we're back into solution that we just need to defend this over time. So for a bank, CSI can be good will to, for CSI can be financial research skill. And that is what for this example, that's what we've done with our food man,

that we have a lot of data. But we're taking back with great and critical sector that we can use. Like our purpose is to create more wealth. But what we're going to block that from go down to is how do we create more wealth?

because they don't have to make it secure in one major area. When I try critical sectors that we, I'm not going to have this is how we want to build your systems, is how we want to create it very deep.

And those critical sectors are what we call the ad-to-the-adjector. The ad-to-a-a-t is what we have the ad-to-the-adication. We have the education. We have the ad-rig of full security.

We have the new energy, and we have the transport system. And we have a hot crossing to the program that women development and inclusion, harnessing the immigrant has to do

with your development and the enterprise support. So many of you will be accessing from the topic we're having to do on Black Star, right? It's yes, I've been to see it or CSR.

Should use the Black Tux is not a public system problem, right? Well, we're looking at it from a structured house to trade as problem. So Black Tux is real Korean.

It's inter-gularation now. is a emotional and tight acceptance. But from a CSI like, the goal is to, in obviously from the getting started,

or not that, but to structure it better. How do we must experience, how do we adapt from education to enterprise? How do we bring partners?

How do we create family and my data support that we do? How do we have women in livelihoods for us? Like we've done us, so we are progressive dollars, or how do we have cooperative investment tools?

So yes, the difference is there. And I think the comprehensive investment is something that I've addressed this black touch challenge and I believe I've moved more.

We talk more about that. But what's your either? All right, thank you so much for that, Solomon. So moving on, we're just going to establish

like the features and framework of what this has looked like. And in mind with that, I'm going to be moving on to if I need the next question, which is.

So why do many young professionals describe black tax as non-negotiable rather than voluntary? Interesting question. Here it appears non-negotiable because it is not just someone asking you for money. Because of course if it's just a random ask for money you can always say no.

But it is family, it is friends and there's a moral thinking behind it which is that This is a community that has given into you. This is a community that has invested in you. Your family has invested in you, supported you,

whether you as you or this to the family. You're all the support to your parents. You're all the support to your siblings. You all this supports to your friends.

And it is that, that thinking around it, that the constraints you're a bit, because yes, you know that maybe your means are limited. But you carry that weight of that responsibility.

the weight of that thinking that yes, I owe this to these people. And of course, there is new thinking trying to renegotiate, that do you actually owe something to your parents? Do you actually owe something to your siblings?

Or are you, and if free in the Uber, but as no linkages to family and community? And I'm not going to pick a side on that, as I think that depends on where you lean.

But I know that as a community, we have values of, I mean, as a people we have values of community. The evil who was on Yana, one layer, one layer means they're enough for sick, you know, like they can, you know?

So we have this thing where you know that you're friends and support you, that you can go to family and they'll stand by you, that you can go to friends that they'll stand by you.

So it's that value that makes it difficult, that makes it less of a choice but more of an obligation. But I think that regardless of whether we see just non-negotiable or a choice,

again, like we said, is mostly about the structure. It's mostly about limits and if we communicate about expectations. The problem with blackback is that there is often no limit

through, there is often no point where we say, oh, you've now paid enough of the stacks and you get to graduate and you never know the support. If anything, as much as your earnings increase,

as much as capacity increases. Your tax also increases. If you make a mistake of thinking of the 10 flights or 10 trips in a year, maybe I think you

can afford to give more to the family. Now, I think maybe you can afford to give more to your friends. So it's that problem with there being no limits to it. There being no structure to it that makes it

feel less of a choice and more on negative. Thank you. Alright, so I also, personally, have always had this been where I thought that, you know, people didn't have to wait for, like, see the government field, like roads.

Like, I think that was an industrial style that was used in Japan. But when I had listened to me, so I'm more curious to hear what Tonya has to say on that question. So, over to you, Tonya. So most of the opinion that it has, you don't have to wait for the government to build the roads.

When I do already functions as a self-government, each family is the own government. You provide your own light, you provide your own home. People fix the road in front of your house. So when you do all of that, so this makes childbearing as well as a village.

It takes a village. The village is not just the cultural aspect or the educational aspect. It's also the financial aspect.

A lot of families that I know have to rely on on-coos, actees that are helpful to get ideas, because we have to send them to school. And when they get to a level,

they look seemingly like financial success. It is not your way of paying it forward. The on-coos and aunties children now to help them attend education,

because when they do invest in the family that has raised you, all you are just creating is another level of poverty if they cannot find an alternative source of income to help them eat it.

Now when you're in a certain way, there is no social welfare. That's what brings it to you. Like this is not a critique of any government. And this is how Nigeria has been functioning.

We don't have a lot of support in the social welfare aspect in terms of like really good, when I say education, education that is international,

community health care is internationally competitive in public aspect. So this not realize on what individuals should provide it.

Individuals that are coming up, individuals that their family has helped support them. And as if I said, this is how when does it stop being too much?

Because it starts with that. Oh, let me help with this hospital views that is putting this person that has helped me in this way.

Somebody else, If I'm here about that bring another aspect of beauty you and then it just keeps mounting and then for you know It's you in this connected web of supports that you don't even know how to remove yourself from or if you remove yourself from which You can see how so many people that you love because this is because when we talk about black task

We talking about the aspect of it comes from The economic the culture. Let's look at it in the face to personal aspect. It is love and beauty Nobody takes off that level of responsibility, if no love and duty and care is attached to it

and it's not something you can just easily restrict yourself and say, I am not doing it anymore because family is where you are is where you are.

So that's the aspect I'm gonna bring out to you, I'd say that as much as I'm looking at this black that's allowed to do cannot be in the hospital or where to where to do this originate from,

our there are so many factors. This conversation I hope as we're happy to define ways that people can look at this sustainable and also know how to sustainably help families

in our communities. I found that was very passionate and thank you so much for that. And on that note, I actually wanted to show this

to so long now to see how this corporate social investment different from corporate social responsibility. I think she touched a bit of that during his introduction, but it would just be good to, you know,

Because what I was talking about is this a duty? Is this something that's voluntary? So I'm so the one just respond to that, using the corporate social investment

and how it's different from, you know, responsibility to because from what, and it's going to what you do, you know, you help communities build, right?

To invest with them and then, that comes into an investment for the future. As opposed to just saying, okay, no, banks should do this, you know.

What men should do this? People should do this. So yeah, on that note, Solarman, are you able to quote you? Yes, yes, I like really.

Okay, fantastic. So the difference, like I said earlier, I think that's making clear right now. So where are you looking at CSR, right?

Like I spoke about that earlier, we're talking about CSR, you can almost be on impact, there's a little bit of the updates.

You know, how do we have to do? Well, you can have the C, the operational investment, and you can have an impact sustainability,

something that can be sustained for way, long time, something that has killed, something that can help you that institution. Why should I just give you like a feedback?

What should I just give you like the women for women, giving just like it is the support of the VA. A grand dimension, can we create something in the form together that each woman can have

a recurring support for a long time working with kids to do that? So the goal and plus it can be shot, the goal and corporate social investment

is on a long-term capacity building and what creation that can be diversified and can be for everyone. And that is the key difference. You'll be looking at it.

So if you look at it, why is it more seated for the Black Arts Challenge? I will tell you that question is, particularly, look at it like, OK, we talked about the Black Arts Agency.

From the CSI line, what can I ask? I hope in this area. I want to get your obviously to ask a profundity difference and also say what we do.

And if I'm not going to know what we do, I think that CFS space and give some more examples that are trying to do that. We're looking at for a mention that it's a talk that we work on. I mentioned it a lot.

going to okay a lot of people want to. Can we keep paying for individuals with our needs? Never important. And we just go into a circuit. All this percent is having a little competition or something. Can we just go there and do what we can advocate? For the CSL, the CSL is looking at how we sort of be

science out system. For instance, in the alternative, but we have the drug reward in front. This is not drug reward in front that people can have a system. States can have access to service. Oh, this brings us the gap on not making making sure that we'll be able to get a little show that every hospital have access to quality

medical drugs as well, you know, that they need. And also there's an access created within that as well. We look at education, I would say, how can we be supporting those things in the middle of the text books? We see as hard as we can do. We then test we go in the tech pictures just paint this school from the school and turn

to make it easier for what we want to do. This is what we need. That was CSR we look at. But from CSR lines, you're looking at how

do we support the entire data and space? How do we create assets? How do we, what we do in the alternative world? We look at the technology integrated

and holistic perspective. How do we create assets? To know what we need to take over that, and how do we create funds that we support

network systems, the new financing, building this classroom, making that mass cost, training decisions, if one of these things are actually

and how do we support them, potentially they have equipment, how do you have gadgets, like an open-down page.

And for the case, whether that's giving their books, how do they have it? It produces them in their environment

and also have a technology that can help them read. And then faster. Some we're doing accurate. That challenge is a close-up look at how do we look

at it, we say. So see aside, you look at it on a physical subject can be more there or something that comes as a little,

as something that can be scalable and more. I hope I can set up this a little. Yes, thank you. It did seem very good picture.

Thank you so much for that. So now moving on from just the framework of what that looks like. For people who don't know what black hats looks like,

because I'm also just learning a lot about black hats right now. But now, just more in terms of solution, right? So I'm going to throw this question to one in the first. What structures will the need to exist for family to transition from receiving cash to holding equity?

That is the market. What is the market for structure? People are no hungry. People are no people where to leave. People know where they need the education. But once the market for structure is not settled, people can't stop seeing shots.

As much as I'm seeing this and I understand this is happening, I do know that I think that's one person within the family, particularly the person who is being taxed the black sponsor. This is for themselves.

I would say that they would start thinking about how they can get their family members or whoever is their supporting to look beyond their agent to indicate that is in a way because I know people that are healthcare is becoming a record issue. Why don't we set up healthcare as well as family?

Or education is somebody's community and access for money for this business to do this and do that. Okay, let me sponsor you a cost to business management. So in way you can start the keynote, it is not only how do I give this person, how do I empower them in a way that can get them to generate their own source of income. If it's family, how can I have

a sustainable model that it would need, it has not depended on me having some level of financials every day. Now, this is going to be, it's going to differ from person to person. It's going to even the default position to position. And I'm also very aware that a lot of young professionals

have chosen above water themselves to even start thinking about this model themselves. And if there's anything I will also personally add, I'll say go and get a therapist.

So you can talk to and I'll be listening to you to even judge the congestion, because this can be something quite heavy to handle. As well, if you are that age where you're even

trying to even put some level of work for yourself. And as the CSR person's amount mentioned, that if you're always you can sit down with your family and say, okay, this is a types of like mutual funds

that they can invest in as a family. There's money markets. This was one of the easiest low risk weight with the best of money.

Now I know that if I end up, it will have more to see on this spot. I believe that this means to me is that we are giving you ideas.

It's a lot of seed to now understand that's why this can be a level of duty that could be heavy for most people. But rather than walking on that with our bits,

you can look at how can I try to show this place that I no longer need to be the soft or the money sauce to disrupt my family that I'm trying to help. Wow.

I really like to be done about the intellectual ones. Is my new owner from class? Yes. I think I just have a couple thoughts.

So, fix the issue of black tax. I'm not a banker. I think that's a solo mod to speak about the investment things. But because I've problematized this thing of black tax about,

I mean, linkulates to the non-existent welfare system or the failure of the government, the fact that everything is private time. You have to have infrastructure and energy. Everything you have to do is an individual.

So, if I think of black tax and I think of a way forward, we have to get the confidence out. I'm sorry, the sound that I'm doing. But whenever I give that audience to K,

I give the audience to K and what is going on in my career. So once we... If we're tired of this and we're thinking of it, we forward, I think the base has to be

that we need to get our comments to work. We need to get our system to work, because if you come from Nigeria to a place that works, in a lot of the things that you get taxed for,

is something that a functioning state would have fixed. So that is one. Then the second is, of course, the government is not working, what can we do as in the future? First is maybe one from a reactive level of giving.

Making it more targeted and making it a capacity-building type of intervention. So if someone asks me for money, instead of giving the audience to NTK, maybe like you said, like when you said, I can invest in maybe training you through skill or

finding you to get a cost. Just something that can reduce future dependency. So that's one. The second is, I mean, particularly for families or families, families can maybe pull funds together in a more structured way. Instead of having one person that we depend on to sort out and support everybody,

can we collectively contribute into a pool? Can we fix the contribution problem? Can everybody have a pool where we contribute to? Of course, we're not going to make it equal contributions

because of in-resonautical. And we don't all end the same. But everybody has to contribute something. The people who end the most, of course,

can contribute the most. But everybody has to contribute something. And why everybody has to contribute something is important, because it fixes the issue of best-not dignity.

As much as we know that Black Lives Matter, know, you know what it is, but it's easy to ask. What's the answer that I get this request? You have to sit back and think that sometimes the pet's in asking you for something. It's taking an incredible level of swallowing your pride and incredible level of just the shame to ask

but the pet's in goes ahead to ask because they actually did it. Right? So everybody has to contribute also because so that way it will keep ourselves accountable. And the next thing I'll see is with such a family poor. This is where the bankers can then come in and tell us, what can we do with the money. So if we're changing our family, everybody contributes on our

contribution. If every month we realize some of our contributions 100,000 are available, 200,000 are. What can we do with that contribution? Do we put it in an investment? Very cool. It's pretty shape-very cool that can maybe incorporate whatever it is, a Solomon, please tell us. We put the money in that.

But again, and finally our rapid here is whatever that that vehicle will be, whatever we do with that pull of funds that we put together as a family. It has to have a shape of purpose. It has to have a purpose. So what are we contributing towards? We cannot just contribute so that we meet only emergencies because if we put it put

together and oh I need Andrequi to fix my this I give to this place. The best way I knew how do I keep? We're going to de-clits the family pool as much as we are as fast as we're contributing to it. So there has to be a goal. Are we contributing to by land? Are we contributing to by a rental property? Are we contributing to something to get some assets that can also

to keep an eye on its own. So I think there's maybe some ideas that can help us chat a part forward. But I would love to hear from that.

Thank you for that very sweet head, Rosalind. I don't know if most of you know this about if I both is going to run for governor in give or take five years.

So please hold him responsible. He's from I think, I don't know if this is so. So yes, please, you heard he had first and you've heard some of his, you know,

how passionate he is. So if he does not deliver, he'll be the next government because he will be there. Yes, because he brought the government

into this conversation. But moving on from that, so when you were mentioned, they have been there. So I'm going to give you, I'm going to give you the opportunity

to respond to that. And then so, secretly, just also respond to why is CSI better suited than CSR to solve the black tax challenge. So the money.

You have to blow. All right, I think you so much. I think if I'm in a new year of sex near, but on the problem, I can't accept the good.

I have given my SDS highlights as well. We can also provide some insight. And also the attention bank as well is already doing things like that.

So if I just call, you don't have an alternative bank. This is a alternative bank, please, please, indicate only one of the questions and sound the shadow going to be ready to work,

to have partner with you. And what we'll talk about is yes, it's very good, very good perspective, you know, in find the way.

Yes, and what you can do for what you say, I think from my CSN lens, you look at how do you separate emergency, you know, how from in a world-building memory?

Well, they didn't learn it very, very, very, very interesting. But that one, the biggest mistakes from this making the best thing when you start doing it next week.

You know, so the practical rule that we can do like, okay, a food medicine, you know, and scuffies and rent stay in a support protection bucket, and all the plants are not software's going to go.

Yes, in the objective, but we do a rule of when it comes to cooperating, we do the way come to supporting a cluster. We are family as well coming back, coming back of that.

And we talk about family. People will look at the self-carement or family. We talk about the market's community.

your consumer, your corporate meeting, the whole part of doing that tax, you are the spreader, who you are from here. I was once too that, oh, we're not a thing you just go.

So make a great measure of blackmail. But you can't find your kindred. You're starting with the support that you're and the best way you can, whatever

that you want to get in the structure. So yes, truth is that. So the truth about this is that what? Well, I don't want to do so long if there's

the family, right? What right I should read, real? and make family support so much. So, to see what productive, and that is what we,

the best way to see a size better than the CSR from the Queensland Wind Act, right, right. The one most CSR intervention, for instance, we use parade of remote, I've given you something

or human and yet tricky, I want to do this as in the 50k. Yep, so, I need a parade of remote. In the lobby design system, we will do that project, does it too?

CSIs but are suited because we look at the platform mechanism. You can look at incentives, you can look at governance and public building that can be supported to access. We do with women.

Three years ago, had a woman, a woman group, I don't want to mention them, but other women who can do that for a lot of women as well. That came together, who both of our women,

we have a lot of thousands of women that are asking for these artists, they're just the same women, and the chairman of these,

and the chairman of these, they're asking them to, you bring this together. Ask them what they do. Are we created a phone for them? Are we not that from the August, future to form? And members from that community can have access to that.

And that involves supporting the human current, human access in this form is doing their business in a groups that are completely because, to our media family that knows they know better, than they know them more. And that was the SS better. That those groups say, you know what, they need this. Let's give them a basket on this. Let's give their flower. Let's give them

them to start what they want to do. But after that, that's when CSI is more better than CSR. So from a CSI line, so the goal is not to do from the organization, or the core of the core of the core

of the core of the core of the core of the core of the core. But the structure, what the structure is better, how do we match savings? And that's the purpose of that, how we deal,

how do we take and take education to enterprise? The more we educate, the business is going to skew. It doesn't have to be to pay for school fees. The question is, I want to sit down with the family and say,

What else can you do? Where do everyone's reaction according for access information? And we have the phone created together,

which is that this person starts up something, and which can depend on the agency to also, you know, for sustainability to share those with their prosperity.

So you can create a family minus it once, we have this conversation. That I think I have a woman that lives in which once. For those of us that also have communities,

we have women who are always connected to you to come and do something for us. But corporate even that says what is it to find the cooperative with cluster than even an individual.

And those family, those family that you belong to, those individuals, cooperatives, come together and we can have this conversation. And that is we see a side.

It's more and more better to have a decision of lactox than CSI. And there's a whole lot of that particular way. It's because starting with remote and family wallet,

you can start with much network discipline, it's a whole lot. You can call how can we, You can also amplify and design what languages you have,

like build a job, right, it's a supercompleting, within your most single chance, between your market association, and even your data is very,

that's happy to be able to give you a simple example, and they're pulling in the phones together. So yes, this multi-CSI product should be that the daughter-fied course doesn't frankly give in,

but what it means that it gives it a course or a structure, I think it's a good question. Thank you so much for that, Solomon. Definitely definitely hinted. I think more of a vision for people who have no idea what CSI is.

And just interestingly, I think alternative bank is the first bank I know that, you know, had a CSI and I just went like, wow, this is a bank that is, you know, know, where ahead of the times and it's driving, you know, the SGM's also notable goals. Um, thoroughly. So now moving on, um, I'm going to do this to vote if I and only as a lady you can go for a piece. So what legal and

regulatory risks exist when multiple family who not multiple families for money together outside formal financial institutions. I think that I'm going to tell you that we're not that I'm not a lawyer. So, if everything I say with the pinch of salt and air households,

a lawyer if you are in a situation where you are at the Black Taxi. First of all, a lot of the funds that we see being given to family is giving us the expectation that at least if I'm in that situation I'll be held back or if I need that money back as a case of this, let me digest what you're taking out

paying you next week. Then a webinar agreement is not admissible in the court of law. My sister, she said she's not sure the law, she's like anything anybody tells you is one of the lowest means of evidence you can bring to the Nigerian culture.

So when you're looking at anything legally, you're going to do any form of like investment with family of any form of business. So I'm running this business. I invest this.

I give it some amount of money in this social amount of this. I would argue even if you cannot have a lawyer in putting a place, have something pretty similar, as a form of MOU and I'd remember between the bottom of you. Because even organizations, businesses, government have everything written

because the aspect of human attitude and human need to just have this set to work with commit to place. But also know that when it comes to family days, also the aspect of you tripping and like what do you mean? this becomes somebody that will take that money from you. I'll say that everybody is in

your center to prevent you to put, it takes nothing from you to protect yourself from family, especially when you are in this dynamics where you are the social provider. So if someone is coming to you and it exceeds everybody has the personal amounts within them that you can say is the forgettable amount of money. Anything that exceeds that acceptable amount of money that you

ready to give away. I'll say, have you written down somewhere? Have it in the form of document? Have some kind of weakness even? Because I went with friends marriage and there was a weakness to say that I saw this. So why would you be giving somebody money and no-habble? We can't say, I saw and I know about this exchange that went through. So this helps

protect you in a way that allows you to recover it's your phone if you are going to look always to recovery tips. So this is the only aspect of advice I can give at the moment. But anything else I would say that's you know in Nigeria this is a beauty of community. I say try and have a lawyer within your community to help you for all those informal advice.

You know as you're being blocked at horrifying community of friends that can help you go through those final lines to reach you and figure out ways. And saying this can also be a kind of Obviously, it's a linear cognitive support. If you're going to be leaned on,

you better find what you can lean on as you find ways to... I see find ways to legalize or evolve for my life's dispersal.

And I think there's a lot of stuff about that, thanks. All right, thank you. Thank you. I think there's a lot to have an announcement

with this one. I'm not one, I think that's the English person. Who got the question? I think that's the fact that actors,

and so I think that being that, I think that I didn't know that there was a lot of humor on the number of what I got from that.

So if I want to go on to this. Yes, thank you. Thank you, any furthers? A bit for comments.

I think definitely that you'd be a structure to the pool or family pool that we're talking about. There's a bit of structure to it. I think.

If I don't think we can hear you, can we hear it fine? So, everyone, can you hear a poem from your audience? No, no, no, no, no. Yeah, I'm in part of my way back right now.

Yeah, we can hear you now. Can you hear us? Yes, we can. Any time you know?

Okay, I was saying that I think the music structure really depends on what we can find. So if we, if family agrees to create a pool, first the severe structure of contributions,

like I said, each person contributes whatever amounts amount based on how much you earn, and this can be agreed together. But even those contributions should be mandated in a certain way. It should be automated.

If possible, I think this is where it bank comes in or cooperative, whatever it is. It should not be left at a discussion of members to send in money every month, if it can be taken directly from source.

If you have a salary or something, that is a structure that can work. Another thing is that I don't think it's something that we want to do on the individual basis. Yeah, we trust each other,

but it's a best of a structure. So let it be an actual vehicle, a corporate, whatever, with these separate accounts,

with a, you know, that is not accessible by just one person. A bank definitely can support this type of thing. And definitely, there has to be rules

that by Gohran, how we do this, and it has to be sets before we get into it. How much does everyone contribute? What happens is someone does not contribute?

What happens if someone dies? What happens? What do we do with the money? when do we withdraw?

Who gets to withdraw? Who makes the decision on what we invest in? Who makes the decision on when we can take out from the investment?

So we explored ourselves to a lot of leg art, regulatory, whatever the risks are, if the terms of engagement is not defined. We are family, we are friends,

but when it comes to money and structures like this, it's best to pull everything in a very structured format. And that's what I would say essentially, But I think that if as a community we are able to hack this,

we will substantially change the game and the narrative around this black tax, because once the family is able to put together whatever it is, you get a message, you're making it easier

for the next generation, because the next generation now would inherit something, inherit a property, inherit whatever it is, and they would also be able to build on that for the next generation.

So definitely structure structure structure is the name of the game. Thank you so much for that. So I'm just going to show you one last question because we actually like past the time.

But I think this is just an interesting question for a little bit different from everything else we have spoken on. So now this question is how do you build a collective system when the NAS income is irregular or unpredictable? So, that's a question. When the income is irregular, I'm pretty excited.

I think of course, it's, because without saying it's easier when it comes to the experience. It's easier when we know how much, you know, comes in every month. But if, and I understand that question to speak to the contributions that we're talking about,

if it's irregular, it's structured can be designed, you know, based on the context and realities of different families or communities. So we can say that all we commit to giving us a suit amount of whatever any ins that we get. At whatever point maybe the months you get, so the suit amount of money,

maybe you're not sure what you're willing to give 10% of whatever it is the income is. So if I just do gigs, I'd be feeling expressing, and this month I get 100,000 there, agreed percentage of contribution is 10% or 5% whatever it is you decide. I give my 10% of that amount. If I get in the next two weeks or three weeks I also do so. So I think that can be

context specifically designed to fit whatever community or family needs. Thank you so much for responding to that. So we're going to throw it over to the audience I guess if you have questions please indicate or drop up the comment section and so we're going to give you some time to respond to that because we have

about five minutes left on this call so while we're on that I'm going to show you to the panel list to give like you know a 60 seconds close in remark you know whatever you want to say on black parts on this particular conversation we are having on this topic. I'm going to give six SFS funds to each panel.

Let's focus on the remark. So I'm going to start with the lady here on the closing remark. Thank you, either. First, thank you for being here for such a lovely conversation. But I need to think about the different ways and I've meant a lot for a similar morning feedback. So now on closing remarks, as I said earlier, black tax is deeply personal, psychological,

cultural, economic, political, cut across so many different areas of factors. And that messy and toggling makes me very difficult to figure out the mood of their works. Well, as I've already said, you just have to look at, this is what I have come in. When I do three months or is recognized regular, this is what's our test report family.

This is what I want my future to be and they are structurally weighted. You can work with different types of like all bugs that they have on the investment platform. You can look into that.

You can also look into ways to look to say for the future, like I said with the microphones. Particularly, look at what works for you. And look at it, it does not part of the way.

because as you're building your words, it's important to understand that it's not just the now you're looking forward to, you're also looking forward to the future.

So that you also don't end up being the next black tax, waiting for the next young generation to get to a sector level and then you start taxing them.

So I feel like when we have the young generation doing this now, it will help the future generation of coming up to have that space to breathe and grow and then, and then that leads to the level of community

that has been survival. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. Thank you so much.

So like she said, well, it's good to help, but think about the future. Think about, you know, saving yourself. Think about not going bankrupt so that you don't have to be depressed then, you know, coming back to ask other people for black back.

That was a powerful takeaway. And so, so my will give you 60 seconds to respond to this before we get the forward. So if I go to the general months.

Thank you so much, I hope you find it. Thank you, Nina. Yes, we can help you so much. The authentic by what we are doing,

authentic by a lot of misses, that perspective to help these employees from the wildlife and find them in that comment. And what that we do is that we will move your

attack transfer into a coordinated character. And we can help us automate it. know what that was it includes it and and basically without it is a pleasure yeah we have a digital innovation the public and its current collection bank and seeing that could help that was how we

called out connect so your family can be dedicated across that and we have lots of total needs for you. We also hope you will be productive mechanism with mixed-cell prevent checks and avoid weapon and our family stability as well. But there's a lot we can work together.

If you do the half cooperative, look at what we did for the women cooperative in Canada. Yeah, we did those good capacity, what we also enabled them with the system,

women that, and we are livelihood. They have now a new means of livelihood from other social world men as well. We did an electric tricycle,

we had a potential token, a Canon for two cooperatives. And now the dimension, the conversation is the outcome is amazing, right?

Because across the whole lot of things, yes, you can do that with your work. And even your status, or we can do that. Also, you see what we did with the common

talented actresses, but during the Afa Project, that we didn't see a sign, that was addressing something. And with a piece, a bit of piece of online book, we also did a platter stick in varsity.

So you can have the students that we do in communities that help address issues and systems. And we can have this conversation with us as well. And as the girls will show down, we see that,

yeah, we are grateful never to give this complex decisions. And the alternative bank is not really a, can not understand my ideas. And as a family, we will help you structure it.

We've looked as, as being so the black person match, because there's love. You know, no part of doing job policy such as the field to do. But in this step is how do we structure these governance,

produce, we could take some of the things that are very important. And from CSI, I will say that the future belongs to institutions, to come to farm into corporations that are bold enough to move beyond and not into our solutions. You can't even see a site we need to go from a social impact perspective, analytic funding, impact investment. If we can have families

is called virtual communication utilization. But not just analyzing it. We need to move from organizing it into ownership of family owners, community-led community-owned businesses

as well. Then we do all that we do spread it on the first one or the first job of young professionals. When we need to come together, you and your

attention about corporate pathways that can help from survival to dignity, help remedy our stories and from black tax to black capital. So look at those key critical sectors,

look at areas, look at those conversations that you can have together, you can drop them on the shut box and we take it and trust me,

you're potentially banned, we keep innovating to telling ban this, and this is one of the less critical systems we get, and less critical black capital,

we make it sustainable, and let make it sustainable as well. I've actually got a thank you. Thank you so much for that solo man and if you didn't catch you know all of

all of what he said just know that you can visit us at www.allspanc.ng and you'll see a lot of what we're doing off the laws on national media platforms all across the course board even on LinkedIn too you know follow a lot of what we do and you know just see how you can be part of you know this here as I am

other stuff that we have had exciting products. So I'm going to yield the mic to be fine for people on close to the map. Okay, Doug. I think a lot has been said. I'm just going to say that we as a people, we are bound by that spirit of community and there's a reason why I mean Nigeria and so Africans are very resilient and it is the fact that we are therefore one another.

we have that feeling of responsibility for one another. You'd find that most Nigerians would leave and move to other times where they're not so into the community thing, find it hard to integrate a bit. And I'm saying this just to say that this conversation is about finding the balance

and it's best to stick in the middle and not swing towards any extreme dimension. We're stronger as a people when we, you know, we buy into that spirit of community. We're definitely not able to support our friend and family, but definitely we can also marry that together with a structure that makes it sustainable and variable for all.

So I'll leave you there. Thank you very much and thank you Ada. Thank you to all Bank for having us on this conversation. All right. Thank you so much. I really want to say a special thanks to our panelists. I have been driving the Apugilichrist Society which is by the way Apugilichrist

to be a community. So yes, now, you know, she's been highlighting the diversity and other things. And she was just a solid one.

So I want to say thank you to her, as well as if I was with current curator of the Abu Jago Shifa. And I'm just, you know, she's actually currently based in London, but we're

able to catch him during his time in Abu Jao. And they actually came to law in Abuja to join us to have this conversation. And so for anyone who would still like to recover

this conversation, sure there's going to be a leak. But expect to see some real, some videos on our social media page where you can actually see them in real time. I'm talking about black facts.

So thank you to everyone who's joined. And we're hoping to get comments for a lot of comments. going to be closing this session now. We intend to so come back again this May on the 30th press and on the present of May with another interesting nine-time native expaiseu. So thank

you all for joining and first on all our Instagram pages, our Twitter pages and LinkedIn as well to not meet out in the next ex-space. And happy walkers, thank everyone. And so, Solarman, the leaders here,

by as well for making his time. So, I'm going to join us specifically, but, you know, made the time and commit head to being a part of this session.

Thank you all once again. And I'm Ida Aloha, Vamee Gao, BMCD Abuja. Have a nice day, everyone.

Episode 03
Household economy

The Jollof Index

Food prices, women's work, and the real household decisions behind Nigeria's everyday economy.

01:10:18 Household economy Open on X
Open full transcript

having some issues. So, our next time I apologize to everyone who has been disconnected twice already. So in order to save time, we're going to jump right into it. We have Shabbalah here. And so while wait for the rest of the panelists, I think Nabil has also joined us. So while wait for a smile and a smile and zay now we're just going to start with getting to a few ice breakers.

So now Shavala, okay as well as here and Abila, we can for zay now. Hi, a smile. Can you hear us? As my, my end is still shows that you are listening. If you can here is please request to speak or if you already have please say hello again just to make sure you can hear us. Hi I have been given it. All right thank you thank you all once again for joining us

and please once again our apologies when informed that I've been informed that the platform is having some issues. Now we're going to dive right into it so now as small what's your idea of the ultimate non-junietives? I think from the word itself the ultimate non-junietive is someone who really embodies everything Nigeria represents

you know like the passion, the ambition even our very unique sense of humor I think there's just so much depth to our culture and one thing I find most interesting is how expansive we are like Nigerian's initially everywhere across the diaspora but they're still such a strong recognizable identity. So I would say for me being an

Nigerian Native isn't just about where you're from or where you are it's also about how you show up. I think you're that's quite beautifully said. Shavala, and you're only what do you want to add to that or do you have a different take? Shavala? So how about you Nabi Lao? What's your idea of the ultimate Nigerian native? Hi Ada. My idea of the ultimate Nigerian native would be someone, I guess this

is a woman's month old user woman. It would be a woman born in Kaduna who learns to eat South Eastern Sioux, South South, South, Subs, Bangal, Finn, Salah, or Ah, and Must Lake, or Pardon me, and makes it as a professional.

That's the idea of the regenerative. That's my idea of the regenerative. Thank you so much for that. How about you, Zena?

What is your ultimate idea of that regenerative? OK, so I think for me, generally speaking, Nigerians, you know, are greater strength and perhaps weakness at times. That ability to adapt to any situation.

And the more you look at it, it's clear that to be able to adapt to frequently. There's a level of innovation. Hello. Hi, are you there? Yes, how do you say that?

Yes, we can hear you now. We can hear you now. Hi. Can I go ahead? Yes, then. Please go ahead.

Yeah, so saying does this level of innovation and thought thinking that one has to have? So for me, the Nigerian Native is someone who carries the Nigerian culture with intention, someone who's able to draw inspiration from what's this come before them, and most importantly to innovates an embodied that spirit of resilience.

All right. Thank you so much. So I think I'm Shavala is able to hear us now. But just moving on to Shavala, if you can hear us, what's your take on Jilofrais? Are you Jilofrais girl or fried rice girl? What do you think that Jilofrais is an absolute necessity? Or is it just overhyped? Sorry, I'm just joining. I think we're having some technical issues. Of course, for me is Jelof is Jelof rice for sure. Because I feel like Jelof rice is a bit more versatile.

Right? And fried rice just falls very easily to be honest. So I think Jelof rice for me. And Jelof rice takes probably minimal effort. Okay, all right, all right. Thank you for that. A bit of a fried rice girl, but no matter.

All right, so now we're moving to a debate on the jalof index. You know, if it's a visibility or elimination, our limitation. So now we've introduced the jalof index as a way to measure

Nigeria's economy through a women's label. But you know, let's sit with the question honestly. Does this frame in honor of the women who carry Nigeria's informal economy? but does it limit them by tying the value back to the kitchen?

So now we have two points. Oh, I'm sharing two points to consider here. So the first one is visibility. The drill of index centers on women who are often invisible. That's like, you know, the E.L.O.L.S. because good vendors, farmers, and in the visibility perspective, it says, your work matters. Let's measure it. Let's fund it. Let's build policy

around it. Now for limitation, do we think this is reductive? One we celebrate we're mentored jalof, are we inadvertently suggest in their highest economic value light in the domestic sphere? What about the female engineers, the tech founders, the venture capitalist? Does this framework trap women in the roles we're trying

to help them grow beyond? So now this is open to all the panelists, but maybe let's hear your take. So I guess if the question is are we inadvertently doing that I would say yes we are. I give you the July index is great at surface level it does represent women in many ways especially women in the informal economy but if you think that the the average Nigerian will hear that and

think of a woman who is curtailed to the kitchen is confined to the kitchen. Many means that you need a lot more social engineering, a lot more effort for people to see the word jolof itself as more than just a meal that's prepared in the kitchen, especially if you're using it as a metaphor for women. I would say that if the ultimate goal is to uplift women into just about every sector or society,

whether that is a development sector or cultural space, then we need to, we need to use a more expansive word. Something that's more reflective of what we want as opposed to where we are and forcing people

to conform to that idea of Jollof beyond what they've always known. All right, thank you for that passionate take. So, Asmao, are you for visibility or for limitation? Honestly, I see the Jollof index as more of honoring women way more than limiting them.

Anyone who really gets it will look past the food will look past the Jollof price and see what's actually going on. They'll see the creativity, they'll see the hustle. And like I said, I don't think I said this, but women are literally running the markets. they're calling the shots and they're keeping the whole economy moving.

I have we spoke about this the other day and you pointed out something that actually made me think and it was how we don't really know where Jilofra is came from or who actually created the recipe and that's just one dish but it shows how invisible so much of this work is even as it shapes our culture. So while it was a metaphor it's also one that highlights women's

contributions and I'm glad it's something that we're having conversations about. All right, thank you so much for that. I'm such a well. Do you have a different perspective on asmau's take or are you on the BLS side? Let's hear your thoughts. I think all for visibility to be on this because a lot of women are going to take this rules

regardless. So bringing the conversation to it is very important on funding the spaces. Because for the longest time, there has been this misconception that women fought for their right to work. But no, we've just been fighting for our right to get paid and for the work we're doing to be acknowledged and valued. The reason why a lot of all of this other industries are seen as being more valuable or there's a lot of funding going there, I think it's because it's mild-dominated.

Check engineering, ETC, but when it comes to cooking and domestic labor, it is assumed that it is our role to do those things. And you know it has also become a thing of not uploading the fish for swimming. But in reality it is real work and the country can really not thrive without this domestic label. Like domestic order, why the country cannot thrive without women's label.

So but I know that we also have to be careful to not reduce women to only this rule. And that is why I feel like these conversations are important to you know, make women visible, not just to box them. as it's starting points for a brother recognition and investment.

All right, thank you so much for that, Trevor. I'm inclined to lean towards yours. But you know, let's hear from Zay and Avlas the Sozena implementation of visibility. So me, I think I'll give it Nabila. I'll be honest. I find the frame in a bereductive. And I say that we respect for the intention behind it, you know, because the intention is right,

It's basically seeing matters. Counting women's label matters. But I think we need to interrogate whether this very cool we've chosen this job of index as a name

will actually serve as a ticker star destination. And I think the problem is we live in a society that's already consciously and unconsciously outside women to this roles, the kitchen, the markets.

And these are not neutral images. They carry decades of social messaging that says, this is where the woman belongs. I so very build an economic framework

and uncoy it's to something like Jell-O-Fries, even as a metaphor. I think we are sort of borrowing that imagery of dust fair, right?

So women's labor is very expansive. We already know this tech, finance, healthcare. And so when we want to say for an index, when we call it something, call it that it is a woman's

label, woman's label index, it says it's all. And it does, it's not reductive. It just says it for what it is. So I think that is more honest.

And it tells the public exactly what we are seeking to measure and exactly whose work we have counted. So I think there's a power in calling it exactly what it is. and not kind of quotes in it in that sense.

All right, so thank you, Zayna. I feel that there are probably a lot of women who agree with you. But then just as a fun fact, apparently,

the SMB intelligents, they do this drill-off index, right? And for them, the drill-off index is a way of measuring like the nature of the economy. Like if to indicate if it's an indicator of if

the food crisis is worsening. So they use that and they publish quarterly reports to see that. Like if women can make jular fries that's like a week to tell that's an indicator of, you know, people being able to afford food. So for me and in my perspective, I think it's larger than just food. I think it has to do with nutrition, it has to do with quality of life, it has to do

it you know just quality of life how we're taking care of ourselves and what we can do and so how women make that rise is a great way to tell if the economy is scaling up or if it's going down but that's my take so moving on now to Asmao, if Jollof is the one Nigeria we agree on And if for many people who missed it, I think that's my last day during the first call before it is connected. She said that

Jeweler Fais here is a metaphor. So now bearing that in mind If jeweler is the one Nigeria, we all agree on and women are staring the pots Can we say that women holds the nation together? But now this question is for Aphmau

Yes, absolutely honestly, I think women are holding the nation together. So anyways just like what Zaynab said, like we see women in finance, in tech, in music, in all these amazing spaces and the creative industries in healthcare and we're literally in every field and not only are we figuring things out we're thriving and like you see it in markets and in

startups and in households and they do it without nobody even noticing. So if you're asking me women hold the nation together. I'd say yes and the ways they hold it together is quite like expansive and I feel like if I get into detail we'll be here forever so I'll just end here. Women are holding the nation together. All right thank you. Nebula do you have a response? Do

you agree or do you have a different take on that question? I wouldn't have a different take to be honest. All right. I think that if anyone has a different tape, then there's a limited view there. If you've already said that the jalof you're staring the pot, then you're preparing to produce certainly definitely holding the country together. All right. So now this question is open to

open to Chevala. But maybe like it also respond to this. And this question is, are someone who thinks about economic output? What is the jalof index actually what in real terms. You know, when we come to a men's labor and for more economy,

so Shavala can go ahead and be like it also respond. I think it's very simple because we meant driving huge portion of the

informal economy. The market women, the farmers, the cooks, all of them, they drive a very, very huge portion of the informal economy

and that value and the value of their labor runs into billions. Like I don't have a specific number but it definitely runs in civilians. But because it sticks outside the

formal structures that were used to it's it's not counted properly. So it appears that it seems like the value does not exist. Our GDP could grow by almost 20% if we may be fully included. Perfect. Perfect. No, no, no, do you have anything to add or are you dut to really agree with your

I think what we're missing out is that tells us what it is worth. Right? So you're asking what is the value of the gelot index? Well, the value is exactly what Nigeria loses every year by not including women,

whether in the informal sector, even in the formal sector, how women are still on the back end with the rebasing of the inflation. with the rebasing of the inflation, how inflation is calculated. This was sometime last year.

There were attempts by the government to kind of include more of the informal economy. But that's still a long way off. Right?

And I think it was the minister of women affairs who were saying that we could contribute to what is more than $200 billion to Nigeria's economy between now and 2030, if you had more women inclusion,

which specifically also speaks to the women in the informal sector. So I would say that if we framed this from the negative, from the lost perspective, it kind of hits harder to home. If you're telling people that even globally, by the way, this is a conversation that's had globally, there was a study from 2015 or so by McKinsey,

where they said that globally, better representation of women in every aspect of life would contribute to what was around I think 12 trillion dollars to the global economy. So if you just talk about what we lose it tells you the it's kind of like an inverse way of seeing what the value of the index is. Well strongly pertinent Beyla thank you so much. So while we're on the topic of numbers

now this next question is to Zayna. Zayna, sorry I'm just going to have Elham. So Zayna, well how many billions of NARA are we losing? By keeping women's labor in the informal category instead of fielding their transition to creative and export industries. Okay thank for that question. I think the number I think the number for the informal economy right in nine years sits around 57

percent of Nigeria's GDP and women are accounted for it's seven percent of that. So even before we do any modeling we can say substantially and a larger amount of that money is on our concept for rights as part of our national altitudes. And I think the minutes of women's affairs has also mentioned that you know just by closing the gender gaps we could potentially add around 15 trillion

NARA to our country's GDP. So I think this isn't just a woman's issue in our solution. Nigeria has historically never had a strong record of branching out beyond oil and gas anyway. So we have no four decades that this resource dependencies, vulnerability for our country. And yet every time that there's an opportunity to meaningfully invest in alternative sectors like

the creative industry or agriculture. We don't take it seriously, we do it halfway. So we build this rhetoric but not the infrastructure and the people who are most affected by it are the women because women are more concentrated in this informal sectors that we treat as secondary. So you know I know the efforts and I want to be fair about that.

To mention, you know, Outbank has some women for college. She's also a streets of services, you know, such as Outbiz. So there are people working towards ensuring that, you know,

women are brought into these formal sex or that are supported at the same time. So and that's why I also speak this like this matter. Because, you know, advocacy changes,

what's considered normal. I think we stand again a lot by sort of friendly and the transition from Decuetive to the Xbox industry is like huge version either.

All right, thank you so much for that passionate response, Anna. And to everyone listening, I should mention Altbank Biz to know more about that product.

You can visit www.Altbank.ng to see more on the product. to now moving on and while still on the topic of data and numbers. Now according to the PWC MSME survey, women are approximately 41% of micro businesses in Nigeria.

Yet they receive less than 10% of available credit. Now Nigeria itself ranks at the bottom between the 20% globally for female economic participation according to the World Bank.

This question is to Shavala first and then the Bila. So the question here is, if we gave Nigerian women the same access to capital as general counterparts, how do you think that would translate into our GDP?

But I think Zena already covered that. But if you have anything else to add, you could just mention that now. So Shavala, you didn't float to you.

Oh, okay. Yes, she has spoken more on the numbers already But like you said, we've owned micro businesses do so much with just 10% available credit that they have.

Micro businesses are already supporting families, communities, and child-local economies basically. So I feel like if women had access to funding, we not only see a very huge jump in the GDP growth,

but also stability in the society as well in household. household because the return on investment, women are very, very more likely to invest back into the community and into their families. And additionally, right in Nigeria, women women have a repayment access to loans. They repeat them at very, very high rates like

about 95% for businesses led by women. And also, global researchers that women's We are very significantly higher than the demands across many types of lending. So I think this is just

to say that when we may invest that in and when we have access to all of these loans it's just smart economics. Like the entire system is stronger

financially basically. So yes. All right. All right. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for sharing that. So investors listen and what this basically means is

they invest in women. If you finance women, we actually pay better than men. This is a very, very important thing to note. So, Nabila, do you have anything else to add to this? I mean, if I look at both the responses, the enables response kind of covers on a macro level, in Chavala covers on a micro level. The World Bank has an estimate where it says that, look,

if you've got more women in that are captured in the economy, give them more access to credit and everything, right? You will see a growth in Nigeria's GDP by 2.3%. And it's a, it's kind of like a figure that's up in the air for a lot of us. We don't even know what that means. If you translate it to Naira, you're talking what is about 13 trillion Naira added to the economy. And if policymakers were

paying attention, in the last few years, the government has been going on about no money as as of right now, the 31st of March is just a few days away and everybody's thinking about how you file your personal, your taxes, you've never done that before.

But you also know that when government is trying to mop up more through taxes, it means that they're looking for more money to do whatever it is that they want to do.

Now, this 2.3% that the World Bank attributes to women inclusion if you have them in Nigeria, really just means that government can actually build budget by about 13 trillion Nira without taxes. This isn't fresh money, right? It's not money

you're trying to raise from the citizens. So you've got that growth on that macro level. But if you, if I tie it to Shavala's point about the micro level and how it translates because you know, we've been hearing, oh yeah, inflation is coming down. The exchange rate is a certain way. We all know what the cost of transportation is today. But what does this really mean for you is going to

to the market to buy your food. What does this really mean for you who needs money to be able to send your kids to school to pay your rent? And automatically, when you look at what the figures say

about women and how they spend money, you know it translates directly. So if that money is going into their business, you can rest assured that a woman is more likely

to hire more women in her business. So even if you're not looking at gender, you put more like the fee of 50-50 representation of the genders in that business or tilting more towards women than men. And by that alone, you have a trickle down effect where

those women who are employed also use their money for whether it's schooling, it's feeding, it's everything else that they're doing. So that's the real benefit of pulling more women into the Nigerian economy and actually giving them access to capital. Thank you so much Nabilah. I totally enjoy that because you mentioned a lot of things that we've

failed to consider even as an economy and as a people. So just zayn up to you. This is a very short question. So why is it that one that Nabilah suffers and that ties back to what Nabilah said? We all know how much fuel is right now. So you're talking about subsidy removals, spikes in a few prizes, narrow a devaluation.

So that's an estimate that women owned businesses take the best hit. Yes, it also records that we work like the last to receive bailouts.

What is your take on this? I would say it's a myriad of things. It's a complex issue. And we can approach it from different angles.

First of all, I would say the government, obviously, not having the foresight or rather the unwillingness to give the necessary support. Despite knowing that these policies or events will have drastic and repaint effects, for instance when the first subsidy was removed in May 23, it was not a surprise.

It was something that had been floated for years and yet there was no tangible preemptive buffer for the most vulnerable businesses. child disproportionate be women or businesses operating on the tennis margins. They saw their operating cost rise immediately. So what I would say is

women's labor is generally expected. It is taken for granted in a way that makes it invisible to policy. You know, that food vendor around your area, combing or shine for high school, never crash through. That's what she does. It is also expected for her to open shop regardless, right? She finds a way. So there are zillions of

expected. It is never protected. And I think the government does not design relief programs around businesses because the assume, assume the who survived regardless. So my honest answer will be the why this keeps happening is because we're comfortable with this and that and that comfort is what we need to examine and the government just take him more

taking a different approach I think to these policies. Those are the big trust and compliments of the big shaky but I think that's actually where the main issue is yeah. Thank you, Zena, but thank you so, so much.

So now moving on to ownership, exports and soft power. My next question is to ask my old. Now, I smell this might be a bit tricky, but still, you know, when the world streams up or beats, because we know that lots of musicians are making a lot, like a lot of

Nigerians are making a lot, like making a lot of money when it comes to up or beats. Now, the world is actually streaming Afrobeat and it's 18 July price, right? Like, there's one that's debased.

You find a button called Ganyan Strelof and then Jiren Strelof. And, you know, there are restaurants like Legos, Bistro in New York.

And there's a, you can see that there's a huge market as well for our cuisine, which is in this center of price. But this, like we said, is a metaphor. So it can tie into other aspects.

But now you're putting Afrobeat against something else that's ultimately Nigerian maybe champion by the woman. So now when the world streams alphabet and it's the proverbial drill off, they're consuming Nigerian culture, but who gets the royalties? You know, we've seen

one largely in the space of alphabet and movies, but there's still a space, there's still a space that's lacking. So I'd like to see you respond to this please. Sorry, could you repeat that question? and I got a call mid speech. Okay, all right. So it says here that when the world streams are for a bit and it's

July 5 now the metaphorical, metaphorical gel of the acconsuming Nigerian culture, but generally who gets the royalties. So there's a huge disparity in terms of you know Africans or Nigerians making money off of something and what's high in the alphabet something that just generally speaks to anything that a woman is championing.

Okay, I actually love that question. Who's really getting the royalties? Like we know the world loves our culture, our fashion, music, food, even knollie wood, but then the truth is that people are actually creating it, especially women and the small-scale innovators rarely see the recognition or real ownership. I guess I can see the culture travels far

but the credit often doesn't follow and I don't really know where the royalties are going to honestly. That's why it's enough to celebrate abroad. That's why it's not enough to celebrate abroad I mean. We have to make sure the creators are seen and valued and benefitting too. And also as a creative, I have seen this, especially within my UGC business, I've gotten a lot of

enquiry, reserve-arding foreign concepts and them tying it back to Nigeria. But then they don't want me like claiming it, they just want to claim it for themselves. So I think it's important that we have these conversations. Thank you so much, Asmo.

Not to matter. Do you agree with everything she said or do you have something bearing in mind that you also your filmmaker and it might be different in the film industry for women? Yes, I completely agree with what she's saying because as far as the law goes, nobody is getting reality from this. even as global as it has become, it's in songs, you know, and everything.

It is very unfortunate. But it's also why it is very important for women to tell their own stories and documents, their stories. And, you know, aside telling the stories and, you know, pushing the narrative,

we also need to look at monetizing these things. Monetize your intellectual property. Don't let it go on acknowledged, right? Because it is wanting to say, you know, invest in these things and structures,

but we need to also be ahead of it with not being humble. Like, document everything, say everything that you need to say. There's no money in being humble about the brilliance of women. Right? And I noticed this among women a lot.

You know, you speak to women, brilliant women doing amazing thing. And you just water it down. So, you know, even in the film industry, you know, I just make films. I just carry, you know, mics here and there.

But they are doing amazing things. So I feel like we need to be very, very loud about the things that we're doing. So that it travels further because we are responsible

for promoting our own culture as well. Yes, Shabal. So I think my biggest takeaway from what you've said is as women stop selling yourself short.

That's exactly. We need to be able to position ourselves. Thank you. So Nabilah, it's a wrap up the self power and ownership

and expert conversation. So that the world is happy to eat our metaphorical gel off but I'm willing to invest in the Nigerian women who invent it.

My immediate reaction, my immediate thought on that is it's because they don't see the women. If you take the metaphor of cooking the gel off rice, you cooking does not necessarily mean

that you're the one who's going to serve it, right? You cook the food, even in a regular mama put restaurant, it's not really looking at your face. You are not looking at her face, which you want is the food.

So you have eaten and you've moved on, you've paid for it, and you don't have any problems. If you think about how men, global investors come into a space, those who are intentional

want to know more. They want to understand the nuances. And so they will find somebody, someone who's like a less full of the person

that cultural translator. Now, if that cultural translator is not also conscious about women, then you will miss out on a lot. Right? But if you also think about how just globally, right, investment is, it leans more towards men than it does towards women.

There's a trickle down effect. And in a country like Nigeria, where the gender disparity is as large and as wide as it is, it only makes sense that the equivalent of our gender disparities, what you see in investment. So even when you talk about, I think earlier, you were saying that Nigeria has what

is within, was it the bottom 20% when it comes to women accessing credit? Right. Now we also happen to be in the top 20% for women owned businesses in the MSMEs, right that are classified as MSMEs. And that is really just a function of numbers. If your population is an estimated 213 million and your culture already puts women on the back foot and women make up

nearly 50% to about 50% of your population, you will see that higher numbers of women. If we just leaves a percentage as a loan and we use the numbers, you'd find that more women are at that disadvantage. And so globally there is the problem of investment in women. Locally when they then come down here you will find that that problem shows up more and more.

It's just that it will be adjusted for scale depending on what sector it is that you're talking about. Thank you so so much and thank you for also just highlighting the women behind the scenes because I think I never thought about it. I never thought about how even when I go to the restaurant I only look at who's serving me and everything about the woman behind. I'm going to, I'm going to take that

a new more conscious about that, about that going forward. So now I'm going to move into some hard questions which has to do with perception, policy and power. So now this is open to everyone. I'm going to start with Asmao and not go all the way down to Zayna Boul. So now the first question as builders and founders in your own rights,

what have in your biggest challenge? For me, I'll say one of my biggest challenges has been navigating everything at once and being taken seriously across different spaces.

I mean, I wear a lot of hats. I'm a makeup artist, a content creator, an entrepreneur, a writer, a photographer, recently a graphic designer

and I'm doing all this while sitting biotech. So sometimes people struggle to see how it all fits together or take me seriously across my many fields I guess, but it's really just about proving that I can be multidisciplinary and still deliver actual value while also building systems to sustain my work.

So the learning curve is steep, but it's also what makes the journey really exciting for me. I've noticed that all your responses are very poetic. I love that. So, it's a while. I'm loving unto you.

Okay, for me, basically is through things, right? Access to funding, especially for creative and impact-driven work. We keep hearing a lot of funding being announced by governments, and bodies, and different spaces. But we don't get the access to this fund. It's just lingering on the top. Right? So that access to funding, we need structure that kind of

gets the fund from the top down to the people that needed the most. Because I know that they and the way they check these things is, you know, who has more experience in some cases or who has who is older or who who who who we know basically. So I don't think there's like enough structure that moves funding from when it's being announced to actually the independent filmmakers

that need it. And also because I focus a lot, my film focuses a lot on, you know, women's stories and advocacy. It's quite difficult convincing people to invest in that basically because a lot of people might want to invest in block boss staff films or you know, male centric films because It's money, but also trying to convince people

that impact stories matter, stories for change matter as well. So those are the two challenges that I'll say I've been having. All right, and I would just like to introduce you, because you mentioned funding.

I would just like to add all of into you, say that. So I'm not sure if you're familiar with a lot of our products. Well, we have like a non-interest, we have a non-interest list of products.

And we do finance and we help businesses. I think Zena had mentioned that, but just to say that, people at this point, since a lot of people have complained about funding

from the government, it might be time to start looking at private sectors like in a alternative bank and how you can scale up your project to your businesses without finance and models.

So now to Nabilah, what has been your biggest challenge as a founder and older? Um, my biggest challenge as a builder, I think it's just, I guess it would be telling my team that they can dream.

So I've worked with a number of younger Nigerians, you know, these are people who are coming into a professional space for the first time for a lot of them or they're in their second, their third year. just the ability to tell Nigerians that they can actually dream bigger than what is available to them.

I know that there is this trope that we say about say Gen Z's for instance and how the world is there's and what not but if you really go down to it, if you work with Nigerians who are coming out of our public universities or somebody who didn't have to go to a tertiary institution and have to make their way through raw dogging life and then they finally make it into the corporate

space you will find that a lot of them need as much guidance as possible. And while we're discussing gender as a thing, there is a trope where it's not actually a trope, to be honest. If you enter most mass communication classes across the country, you'll find that there's a dominance of women in those classrooms, then men. I went to a school where we were mostly women in my year,

then men. But then when you translate it into newsrooms across the country, whether that is in broadcast stations or print or digital, you'll find that there are quite a number of men that then outnumber women. If I ask you to name say five journalists that you know, I'm almost certain that you will have more men on your fingers than women. And if you do have a woman, a lot of them

will be TV related and there's a whole conversation as to why that is. So in dealing with gender, Usually I try to not bring the conversation up simply because and here's why it's I understand that it's a bit odd. I don't engage the gender conversation because I want people to understand that the museum is a level playing ground. The moment I engage it, I engage it because I will see a woman who thinks because she is a woman

she can't do it. And so I engage that and I try as much as possible to work against that mindset, but it is difficult to work against such a mindset because you're just one entity where this person has a personal life. They've got family, they've got friends, they're coming from somewhere. They're realities from the mentally different from now one moment where I say that you can do this,

whether you are male or female. So I would say that it's really just a shifting of mindset. It's a but there's no answer to that by the way. There's no silver bullet that solves it. It's a lifelong commitment, whether this mindset is restricted one or not. All right, that was once again very very passionate. Thank you for that. So Zayneb, what do you have do you have a different

take or do you have something to add or do you totally agree? Yeah, I agree with most of all, has been said, especially with what Asmao said. For me, my biggest challenge would be legitimacy. That is the most persistent, most draining battle, has been suffered for what's ambield in the

particular seriously by the people around me, by the industry. And if I'm being completely honest sometimes by myself. Aaron, a fashion label and an ads publication, which all focus on celebrating African creative culture.

I want to have noticed is consistently people around me have decided without asking that these are hobbies, you know, passion projects. Things I do outside. Well, I figure out what I really want to do.

So, one woman says she's building sometimes the assumption is that she's expressing herself and not actually building an asset. So what I've learned to do and it's an absolutely practice is to breathe ledges missing to my own work and just be a consistent and first believer on what I'm building.

Thank you. And I think that Shavala also faces the same thing. I'm sure I just this might be me as human but I want to think that even when you tell people you film me Caddy, it's probably think you mean actress. I don't know

Oh I Oh, do we have so far? What's the difference when I mention that?

You know when when somebody should ask me or what do you do is like I'm into filmmaking and they're like Actress that's the first thing that comes to the man is like oh you're an actress I'm like what is everybody as you that we meant that into filmmaking at all It feel me. So, but I used to take offense before but now I'm just like it is what it is and

I'm really so also very Proud of the women that have you know open doors for us in the in the film directing in space and the producing You know, they've been doing it so I'm just happy to be there To be like I'm just happy to be there, but yeah, it was a challenge in the beginning

All right then. So now I'm speaking to power. This is also open to everyone and once again we'll be starting with a smile. So now a smile if you were president for a day, what is the first thing that you would do? Well I love this question. If I were president for a day, I would award grants to female entrepreneurs, to founders,

only to anyone, women, obviously, trying to create something without all the strict requirements and regulations. It might not seem like the wisest financial decision to make, like, obvious, but I think it would make the huge difference like it would make a big difference because now it is organizations often make the criteria almost impossible to meet and it discourages the girls like it discourages people

so just being a bit more lenient would inspire so many women to build something for themselves and you'd actually be surprised by how ambitious they get when they actually get the opportunity. Thank you. I totally agree. I mean, I do because yeah women we just need more money. But I'm also like just happy to add that even with the alternative banking rights we've

been very, very transparent about our requirements upfront which I really think translates to you know just having more women in the future get the funding of the financing that they need. But now over to you, Shavada. Okay, I really love this question because I have so many ideas.

So, it might be on hinge, but for the sake of, you know, professionalism. I'll say, I'll make sure that we may occupy 50% of the political seats in this country. Because we may make up 50% of the population. So, it just makes sense that we are also involved in the decisions that affect us in this country.

I think it's so crazy that women occupy less than 7% of the political cities in this country. That's one of the lowest in the continent. It's too bad that it's only men making decisions that affect us as well.

So the first thing I'll do as the president of this country, 50% of the political cities belong to women. And women are now definitely encouraged more women to go into politics because I know right now a lot of women are not leaning towards that because they feel like it's impossible

and it's difficult which it is to be on the hospital as president. I will make that super easy, super seamless and just encourage more women to be in political spaces. Thank you so much for this. I believe ladies and gentlemen listening you guys should already know that when you see those flyers for shevala for president please vote for her because I

definitely want to see that definitely. So now on Nebula what would you do as a president? I probably wouldn't want to be a president president. No but more seriously so I would rather be governor and the reason why is I think that first of impact wise I'd be able to do more. It's kind of easier for you to

even if you were to say governor of Kano, watch for local government areas, it's still easier for you to navigate then being president and you got 774 local government areas.

And yeah, you've got local government chairpersons and governors that are supposed to be accountable for those levels of government, but we know how things are today.

And if by the power of the executive, I had the ability to do certain things, I would want to do it from a governor's perspective, then a president.

And the first thing I'd really do is I will use that, how executive power has influence over the legislative arm and quite unfortunately the judicial arm as well. I'd actually use that to my advantage.

Pull my cabinet together into one room, lawmakers at the State House of Assembly into one room, the judiciary, I'm trying as much as possible to preserve their perception of independence.

But if I pulled everybody into one room, The first thing we would do is actually look at all the structural and legal gaps that put people on the back foot. So essentially how do we improve accountability and structure that accountability into everyday life for the Nigerians who would be, you know, citizens or residents of my state. That is the first thing I would do as your governor vote for me in 2072.

Yeah, so I have a lot of questions, but the first one is that's going to be governor could do in our state. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. All right. But I'm actually like I think I disagree a bit because everything you said is what makes you like a prospective future president. I get great on president. And I think mostly because you're more concerned about doing it in a state, but there's also impacts to be had on a federal level. But with that said, I'm not saying that.

So you know what I mean? From 1872. Right, I will be a whole. So is it not your turn?

Or would you do as president? For me similar to what as Miles said, you know how Nigerian we love cheering numbers around. So what if I'm president?

I would allocate like the crazy sum of money. You know how they said that's 110 trillion or narrow something. I want to keep it to women, businesses like structured accessible capital. I will make sure that all those barriers as my whole soul mentioned, I don't just give

women money, that's my own decision. I'll just give you a hand to talk about money. And how women can make money. So yeah, I totally agree.

So now this is one moving on to the closing, basically we're closing up now. And this is going to try to take a look at the future that we were building. So now in 20 years, what do you want to be remembered for a need-lin? And once again, as well, I'm yielding the floor to you.

Okay, in 20 years I want to be remembered for helping women see that beauty and ambition can all coexist in their lives. I mean I will make up artists some of the time and from what I've seen people don't really see as a necessity or they don't see as something that's attainable.

I mean when I go to let's see Bauchy which is where I'm from and I say I'm a makeup artist and they're like oh that's cute. They don't see I have something that's like serious. Well I would want it to seem like an necessity and I also want to create a space where women feel confident and comfortable stepping into multiple spaces at once. You know like the phrase jack of all

treats. It has such sad rip. But I feel like it's because people don't know the completion of the sentence and I recently found it out. It's actually jack of all treats master of none, but oftentimes better than master of none. So I want people to actually like tap into that, go outside your comfort zone and to go as far as they can outside the boxes that society basically

puts them in. That's a really good one. Once again very poetic. Would you like poetry because I love this point. I really really really really really really really really grateful. Yeah okay. I love this record she's back back. Alright that is a lot.

But yeah when moving to someone who actually writes I think she's about I think I think everyone here actually does write I think Sena who does a bit of writing and Nabila as well. But yeah Shabala. Okay so uh the filmmaker writes I want to be remembered for opening doors for young people

especially women. Like living the door open. I think in 20 years I want a film world where we men dominate the industry.

Because a lot of the times I'm looking for women behind the scenes, you know I want to work with more women, but there are no a lot of women cinematographers, sound operators, all of those things.

So I want to be able to create a space where we men know that this is possible. And I don't want a lot of firsts. We need to move past the first woman to do this first woman to do that.

I want to open doors and leave it open for a lot of women to come after me basically. I mean, we just made history as women, as the cinematograph of Sinha's one, the best cinematograph, the first woman in history. I mean, we need to stop doing first.

That's where my head is going. So we need more women in this spaces. And just answer your question generally. I want to be able to open those

and leave those open so that the industry can be female-tested. And you're clearly, I agree. We need to know as fast as fast. Yeah, I'm in need to know as fast as I can.

Yeah. I can't think of agree. And be a little bit over to you. Oh, 20 years from now, I would want to be known

for building bridges. Sounds quite cliche, but that's what journalism is. I want to be known as the person or one of the people who helped in redefining what public interest journalism is, what accountability is, building more platforms for people to come together

and actually have conversations that help move our country forward. Spaces that allow us to explore the nuances of our identities of our many trials and the collective future that we're trying to build. So hopefully in 20 years we've got in there. I'm saying when I hear that I'm thinking, that's going to be way larger than Christian.

I'm for ya. Way larger than Johnnie. Yes, hopefully we'll have a Nigerian name, an African name that's equivalent to that. All right, perfect.

I can't wait to say it. Love it. So it's a enaboo. Honestly, the same things I'm building right now highlights in the culture.

I want to look back in years to come and see. I had a pattern solely to find an unfortunate culture and the ads that makes us us. And at the same time, I'm sharing the woman

and I know it raised in this because women are the bedrock of the culture. The custodians, I would say. So yes, hopefully in 20 years,

this very cool to be, cool to have other and the participants of that year. All right, hopefully, I can't wait to say it. So now, until finally, we wrap it up.

So each of you will nominate three women whose nine job code you think we can all learn from. So this time around, I think I'm gonna mix it up a bit. So let's not reach a vala.

Ida. Okay. Specifically, my industry I'll say, Mo Abudu, because she's reached hello. But even just adding to that, she has not only built a legacy for herself, you know,

in the ads, but she has also built structures. I mean, like money, basically, like money making structures for herself. And it's really beautiful to see, because a lot of the times I've created, we focus on just creating and we're not thinking about the financial bit of things as well.

It's it's it goes both ways. So finding that balance and still being able to do the things that you love and make money from it, 10 of a 10. I'll say Kimmy are DITI BASS because she has kind of remained very authentic with her stories, right? And you know, not just following the blue print or whatever

it is that every other person is doing. I feel like she has carved a niche for herself and doing the thing that she loves. She's just in her own lane and I love that as well. And then Jade as well. Ocebo, rich woman doing her things, structure and also opening doors for other women as well. She walks with a lot of women. So those are my three nominees.

All right. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So Zayna, you're next. Okay. For me, I was struggling to highlight just three women because why? Even though Nigeria, what we do is achieve. So I would say every woman around me, my sister, my friends, all the very serious loss of inspiration for me. So yeah, that's

It will be my own response. Yeah, that works. So you know, you could be in a very, very, very, bring to breakfast at home basically.

That works. So now, okay, so I think Nebula should go. And then a smile who's gonna wrap it up for us. Right.

Three women, I would start with Anita Aboibei. She runs operations at Big Cabal Media. there are the guys who own a Zipoku and Tekhabal. And I think that young leaders,

young female leaders in certain positions are something to watch out for. For some 20 years time, there'll be a whole other story that's built on their legacy.

Another woman I'd like to spotlight is Angela or more David. She works in development and she's currently Director of Programs at Human Angle Foundation.

And I think that it is the people who pay attention to the developmental gaps where government isn't working, where government isn't doing enough. Those people are the ones who have what it takes

to actually tell us what we're facing as a country. And if they've dedicated their lives to filling that gap, there's definitely worth spotlighting. The third woman, a woman I would talk about is my boss,

Gadria Ahmed. And I'm looking at what has been her legacy. I know that there are people across the country who have looked up to this person, whatever their perceptions

of her happen to be a Northern woman who brings it. So closer to the, to the, to the politics, to me and the other. Yeah, that I thought, wow.

No, no, no. But yes, yes, I would spotlight her. I do want to say by the way, either, well, this is not a woman, and that is why maybe I have

a little room to give one more. I do want to take a moment to spotlight alternative bank because while people are important, institutions are important as well.

And I think that what has this conversation is a critical conversation, but also the things that all bank is doing in different spaces where it's doing them.

It's very important. If we don't have these institutions, we can't effect the change effectively. Yeah, that's perfect.

Well, I said, I'm just so you know, executive director is a woman, KDA, that's what we call, Coro diade mola, and I think she was actually here for a bit. I'm not sure if she was still here, but I know she joined and she must have got in some of this conversations because she's like our biggest advocates like she just all of us take women everywhere.

So thank you so much. a smile and over to you. I don't know if she can hear us. A smile.

If you're speaking, I can't hear you. If you're looking at me, can you confirm if you can hear a smile? No, I can't hear her.

Yeah, me. I can't hear her. Maybe it's from her end. So currently, there's no questions

and in the absence of that, and maybe while we wait for a smile, you all can also just share. you open them thoughts, you know, what you hope the women who listen to you today would take

can take home. I'm sure you've done that, but just in like let's say 30 seconds just share like a few things you think women listen in to take from your conversation or what you want them to take home today. So I'm Shavala, we should go with you first again. Okay, so I just want to shout out old bunk as well. This is such a brilliant initiative,

right this is so beautiful to see and also very encouraging that you know there are agencies and there are institutions that are thinking about us so you know shout out to all bank and like we meant to take away from this is just to have so much audacity to be honest because we are we're nothing without our stories just you know have so much audacity going to the world

read your shudders high and we can accomplish excellent things. I don't know. Zayna, did you hear me? Yeah, no, I heard you.

Thank you so much. I think I was talking over me. Zayna, over to you. But before that, just a quick one.

If you have questions, please leave them in the comments. So, Zayna, your 30 seconds closing remark. Okay, so my message to the woman this name is go big or go home.

The world is yours. Honestly, watch have a set about the audacity. You have to just, no one is going to give what you want. You have to be willing to take it.

And I know there's a lot of fair and a lot of, you know, doubts, but honestly, put down the backbone. It's better to have gone the farthest. you can like dream as big as you can.

If you don't, I know you end up getting there, but you know, that's it. So just dream impossible that be delusional and have fun while doing it. Jenny and me.

I think that would be my thank you so, so much. And the B.L.A.U. have the floor. Right. I would say be resilient with everything that Zina B.L.

has said the shavala has said be resilient. You will fall down 25 times and as a woman, you must get up 62 times and resilience can show up in different ways. I'm just saying that show up every day. Don't let if anybody tells you no, go back to go to the next person tomorrow or go back again to that person 25 times. Just keep resiliences your keyword and

look as Nigerians we needed. All right. Thank you so much for that, Nabilah. Asmau, if you can hear us, you missed a question, which was to nominate three women whose name is Jokhoid. You think we can learn from as well as your closing room up. Hi, I don't know if I can be like, can you hear me? Yes, we can hear you now.

Thank you. Perfect. So three women I would like to nominate first of all, my mom. I think she's like just a superwoman. She stole me everything I know regarding. I don't know like just with them in every aspect.

She's just the most amazing business woman I know. So obviously her first. Second, I would like to nominate as my sister. She is just like the embodiment of the word leadership.

So yeah. And the third person I'd like to nominate is Amina G. Muhammad, because she's... They say that like, at the same school, I guess. Your skull, if that is always the same.

I don't know. Are you guys like in the same class or something? Because she did the same thing. She brought it close to home. So that's really nice. I mean, they're our... By amazing movement. It sold me natural shoes. Yeah. Exactly.

All right, say it comes at room access mail. Okay, so I think I would want women to leave with this like what you're doing already matters like what you're already doing matters whether it's in your business or your career, education, there's value in everything and I would want everyone to know that

You don't have to box yourself in like expand, grow, go after your interest. They don't have to make sense to anybody but you and just start and do as you go. All right. Thank you so much, ladies. Thank you. As Mao, which of Alain, B Lazinabu, you all made this conversation quite important by bringing

you from personal experiences to insights to bring in the numbers. And I'm sure that the ladies who listened up, you know, so I also want to thank the management for setting this up and just allowing us talk about the answer timely in this manner into the audience. Thank you so much for staying with us. And the next old space, 9 journey tip campaign is going to be in April.

So if you would like to hear more of this conversation, tune in and pause on all our spaces, Instagram, X, LinkedIn to just know who's what we have lined up for you.

Thank you all ladies once again and I wish everyone a very, very quick weekend. All right, thank you, I'd love you to. Thank you, brother. Bye.

Thank you. Bye. Bye.

Episode 04
Culture

Nigeria's Spirit

Culture, creativity, and the kind of optimism that keeps Nigerian enterprise moving forward.

01:03:39 Culture Open on X
Open full transcript

But right now everyone, thank you for joining us. Morning everyone, my name is Aida Oluwabimika and I'm a member of the alternative bank creative and communication team.

And I'm excited to answer these conversations. Now, in general, native is accompanied by the alternative bank. A space for people who are into explore ideas, the people and the spirit of shipping,

Nigerian, and Nigeria's enterprise, as well as I'm celebrate resilience in Nigeria. So there were decoded something invincible, but also powerful, which is an Nigerian spirit,

to see what it's actually what how it can be globally competitive enterprises. And we'll be taking question from the audience shroud. So if you have a question,

please drop them in the comments. And together our attention, please use the hashtag, my gender, the native, so we don't miss them.

And they're not able to pull them in. So to help us on practice, I'm joined by neurocaleal, who is the academic advisor to Casino State and former director of investment

intelligence at the Cajun Air State investment promotion agency. Also helped our editor, Mobi, partner of Chicago Africa, who has an MBA from MIT Sloan and a former senior special

assistant to the president on public and investment. But we have a day-quality manual, the founder and creative director of Colli Memorial to Media, which is a potentially minimal to media studio. Until then, welcome and let's get into it.

Hello, I, uh, hello everyone. Great to be here. This is Tyore. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you so much Tyore for joining. I think Collar hasn't joined us yet, but, Carl, if you can hear us, please say hello.

Thank you very much. I had a good morning, everyone. I was a pleasure to be here. Thank you once again. So to dive right into it, let's just give me a moment to see if Carl can also say hello.

Don't think he's in the, he's joined the space yet. Carl, can you hear us have you joined? I'm still to save time while we were waiting for him to get settled in. I just kind of tried right into the questions.

So this question is for everyone that is Tyreville, Calleau and Colleau. So please tell us what your idea of the ultimate management needs of is.

Finally, it can go fast. Great question. So this is the work. My opinion of the ultimate manager needs it.

I think it's three things that are very Nigerian. And you'll find almost every Nigerian. Number one is resilience, very resilient, very hard working, we're not afraid of hard work.

And the last is setting zest for life. I think anytime you enter a room and you see an engineering, you kind of already know before you even meet them.

So resilience, hard working and fun. All right, thank you for that. And Carla, what's your take? Okay, so my definition of this,

and I need to, as you have described, I think we ought to at least tell the audience what you mean. You said it's someone who's a modern Nigerian operator, whether you're scaling, and SME building in tech,

moving goods across borders, and so on. There's not just about surviving, right? Not because the system works, but because you'll figure out how to build around it

through it and ahead of it. So I'd say, building on what Tiocho said is not just about resilience per se. We can go further and call it what NASA entirely

call anti-fragile, which is, you know, a step further, it's saying, how do we embrace randomness and uncertainty? You know, how do we focus on, you know, things that actually build us more as we are subjected to stresses, as we are subjected to randomness, as we're subjected to things that affect us, negatively, shock stresses and so on. So that's kind of like what an angi or any

body is to me. I think the more pressures, the more problems we go through the better we become, This is a step further than you just being resilient, resilient means you're just with standing these shocks and just living through it. And I think another thing really for me is made a cognition.

You know, it literally means above cognition is how you think about thinking itself. And I think that embodies an regenerative in the sense that anybody who understands the limitations of their own cognitive abilities, you know, is as important as it is to understand the key areas of your own strength. And I think an idea I need to also has to be

somewhat historic in nature, because ultimately whatever it is we go through, you're not stoic in nature. You know, wisdom begets toicism, asthoreism does not begets wisdom. If you most of you listen to the likes of an avarava can't, I also think maybe a little bit in your plasticity in it, in terms of how we learn and adapt new skills, changing our habits and so on and so forth.

And I feel once you put all these things together in terms of having the necessary mental health, understanding your own psychology, if you just want to present more clear or have more clarity and thought than the next person, which I feel a lot of an endurance, do have an Australian threat globally. Your one step closer to being, you know,

a major need to or a bigger player in a global skill and anything else where we thrive as Nigerians. So that's my opinion on it. Just things that you do within yourself and out on you know things. That's like perfectly said, Khalil, thank you for introducing that. So basically I wanted to hear the panelists also to find that because it's not something that is frigid,

it's fluid and in all of you your interpretation is also forming going to form the large scale of what it means to be an identity of Stokola as a creative from your perspective from where you sit what's your take on being the ultimate anything. Good morning guys. Being an identity to me is just like what's your own cognitive said is now being resonant. I think I always think about like being in in Nigeria or even

the creative driving in Nigeria. Like you see low creativity when they lived in Nigeria. Like there's no there's no place they go to under their no lack successful and I think that's just what it is like. There's no environmental situation who just in the would not try, right? move always had that talent in us and the ultimate negative zone who can

see chaos and add like its system into each right and that's what we are being able to achieve so does understanding what we can do in the creative world for music to movies fashion or tech we know what like economic culture is right I'm kind of limited to it. So I think I think for more perspective is being able to move

for being a hostler for example to making money or building our institutional attributes. So yeah that's my ideal reality. All right thank you so much for drawing on some for sharing. So the next question here is for Kylie and Tyville which is for both of you to share the the one Nigerian brand of business

founded in the last 10 years, that you believe is globally competitive right now. Finally, you can go first and then tie over, you can respond.

Okay, thank you. A bit biased to the Bitcoin scene. Yeah. Pretty.

So I'm definitely willing to chill some Bitcoin. Despite the bear market, I'd say in the past 10 years, you know, this started off on the streets of X,

Twitter back then 2019, 2018. as a guy called Bernard Parr. He's from Plattu State. This guy was talking about doing some sort of piggy vest

for Bitcoin. And we also got a great idea. And the sense that dollar cost averaging in to Bitcoin was a good idea in terms of volatility

across the few years, the bear markets that were been through a lot of bull markets as well. After developing that idea, it morphed into what's known as Bitnog.

Bitnog now is quite a leading African startup. You can't save invest, you can do dollar cost averaging plans, you can send coins by like stable coins, third party apps, mobile money. You know, it's a crazy Bitcoin ecosystem in one app.

You know, they built on crazy APIs for businesses as well. And I think all these issues that we're having with regards to cross-border payments across Africa and the world, these guys have actually solved it. And I think you do go along with catalyzing the structural transformation

the financial services industry in Africa. So that's my take big look all the way. All right. All right. Thank you, Carl. It'll tie well. Fantastic take, Carl. Absolutely love it. My actually appeal in comparison. So my thought was more

thangatory finery, right? And I'll bring in what's a real economy. Because of just what it represents, right? You know, very few times when African business is completely change the dynamic globally. And this is one very real example. And I don't know that in my

joint business has had this kind of impact on the global industry. Right? Like dangotary finally you have players in Europe shutting down just because this refinery is now open running. And to think that, you know, we're likely to double capacity in the next few years. That's one that's that's selected for me.

I'm going to find a right. All right. So I'm generally like all the blanks definitely hoping to be on your

material list in a very soon. So to call that and call a little if you bought had to bed one one. I'm sure bring you under 35 in the

major in Nigeria today. This allows who and why call you go first. Okay, I mean not to sound like cookie boards. I'll definitely bet on myself.

The reason I behave is because right now my own plan is to build a structured customer currently where I'm working on right now. I'm building a structured R on my company, but not just for myself, but not just to make money, but actually to build the future of nine job creatives. I want to be able to build a community and

in hopes of, for me, I would say I was kind of self-doubt. I didn't go to any creatives school to learn the tools I know. I had to go online, do research, I know that, and I made a lot of mistakes. So right now, my plan is I need to be able to make

like young creatives, no, like the more like, what's the world. I'm just them to be able to know what not to, the mistakes not to make for example, right? And I don't have the tools to be able to create or the tools to be able to build business wise, right? I had to learn business after the fact I've been a creative right. So

So I would better myself because my plan is to build something that can outlive me and something that can help and run creatives. So that's what I take on that. That's perfect.

And even here at all we have excellent products as well that could help young, imaginative and paleo, please share your take on this question as well. I'll be a little bit more selfish. Maybe I'll bet on my little brother Abu Bakr.

A recurring record is building a lot of things in the Bitcoin ecosystem. I think he's about 27 years old now. So he falls within that age range.

Everything from developing the space as far as financing and funding developers, very key. So they actually have people that build these solutions on the continent.

Then he's an investor as well within that space with recursive capital. And then on top of that, he's also on entrepreneur himself, building stuff like World Haulet and all of that.

So I think our bet on him in the next few, maybe 10, 20 years, you know, looking at a billion dollars, easy in charge of that sort of,

get us on one of that time. And shall I perfect? And please let him know there were always open to partner

and retain him on any of this project. And so, Kyle L, this one, the next one is also for you. And also, as someone who thinks about economic efforts, what is it?

What is it actually what in real terms of deniger in spirits? Yeah, I don't could you rephrase that because I'm still having trouble on a spending now question. Let me not get too technical.

Okay. Well, you know, only, so looking at the GDP, for example, you could answer from that perspective. Okay, cool. So like I think, you know, at the federal level, I think we're trying to build a trillion dollar economy. You know, you look at the Nigerian spirit. I think if we even harness

something like the creative economy on its own, that if we are able to at least capture some of the value globally in terms of, you know, streamers, Afro music, you know, movies entertainment, ETC, I think we'll do well. In terms of the economy, we've stabilized it.

I think now the whole thing for us to do in the next four years, absent all political shifts that we're experiencing. We focus on good sectors. In sure, we have the proper social safety nets in place,

because we need to cushion the effects of these reforms as they're coming. They're going to be a lot of shocks. New industries will spring up a lot of jobs

that they haven't exist, will begin to persist in the next few years. And I think we need to brace ourselves. I think is going to be, I think Nigerians will definitely lead us just within us.

It's part of all we're discussing today's part of our culture. And I can't wait to see the exciting things that will happen in the short line, terms of economic output. All right.

That's very, that's a perfect response. Thank you so much for that. Taiwan was the biggest mindset shift required to move from survival, entrepreneurial to enterprise builder.

So you said you spoke about mine says shift there are many things you need but from a mindset point of view I think the biggest is audacity. And that's a lesson that even I'm still grappling with at this point in my journey. I think the same amount of effort, same amount of sort of regal. It takes to deliver on say a million-year project is pretty much amount it takes to develop a hundred million.

The missing pieces of monodacity. Yes, you might talk about being able to access credit and things of the sorts, but to go from survival to actually building an enterprise, I think the missing pieces of theacity.

Okay, that's a wonderful take. I'm calling from a creative perspective. What do you think? What are your thoughts? Yes, so I think my mister also in the line,

But so for example, like I can work from a host like mentality, right? Like host culture. So it's like, oh, let's just get this done. Right.

No matter how in the matter, like, in any means necessary, but like, I'm not learning the okay structures, structures like important, right? Being able to delegate rather than control the situation. So I think that I still have that,

oh, never really so big of a picture outside, like my still set of my capabilities, well, like how to build a structure, right, to be able to even create like a steady income

for my confidence. So yeah, that's how I'll be my channel. Thank you so much, Khala. And I will the next question is for you.

When you look at your business, what else you were actually growing or just? Is it more revenue with the same stress? I absolutely love this question because my view on it is very different.

For me, it's my people. Yes, revenue is important. If you don't get me wrong, revenue is very important. But what I look at the most as a leading signal of where the company will go

and if the company is growing is my people. I did growing. Am I able to find great people and presenters as a team? Am I able to replicate a setting standard of success?

Whether it's me, my partners, or anybody else who's a high-performance or my organization. And the third piece which is sort of, you know, very hard to achieve is when you even eclipse what you believe is a standard of success.

When you erase people who are just so outstanding in a performance, I mean, there are people who have worked in the past the past two I know that if we were in the same age group and I had to go in and interview with them I probably will fail and that's very fulfilling because

now you've really raised a group of extraordinary leaders so for me it's really my people I did growing. That's that's actually quite insightful and I think we have that at all the way it comes to look like nice and talented as well. So Kalo are so many who worked heavily with

the states. I need to look at the tax base in your state. What tells you whether business is a growing or just scale intro? Quite a lot actually. I don't think the problems we face in cousin apically are two just cousin estate. I think is a regional problem. I think it's also an entry and problem if not an

African problem. We tend to look at this from a lens of seeing how do we formalize the informal sectors. Maybe the reverse is the case because since we have been kids every time you come in, you know the problem is always formalized from it lies. What if we need to adapt to the informal sector and build for them around it and so on. So you look at the tax base, you know, it's

it's me going right. You're trying to convince people who have been doing business a certain way for decades. You're not giving the right incentives and this is why I blame leadership, state government and federal government alike, we're all to blame in terms of we don't really have a collective approach in terms of vision. We sit down with these SMEs entrepreneurs,

the likes of Taiwan, Kala and this call, what we need to do is because once they scale right, inevitably they're going to understand what policy can't do for them. We're already seeing this in the technology sector where only when these fintechs go to a certain level did they approach regulators and they begin to understand, oh, we need to keep money aside for lobbying these

regulatory goals because the laws do shape how we do business. So I think even from the onset people are age millennials, gen Z's, whatever, we need to start to work together and ensure that, you know, we devise and design enterprise equal systems that are aligned with some sort of global vision that we all have if it's to build a trillion dollar economy fine, if it's to become

globally competitive, find whatever it is. And I think, you know, like I said, it's not just because in a beast thing, we are continuing to incentivize businesses and customers to formalize register and show that we have the relevant incentives in terms of discounts. I'm building permits, getting their licenses, getting their COOs and so on and so forth. So it's

It's an ongoing process. The ease of doing business reforms will be forever. And we hope we get there, shall allow India, and to shift the mindset and create the linkages

and implement the plan that we have in place. Thank you. Thank you for that, Hallelujah. So, Ty will, you did work with,

you did work as a special advisor to the President and the public and investment, which I believe also enables reforms. So, do you have a tax-based perspective

you can you can you can tie back to your state or even a future. So what are you talking about? So can you take the question again? All right. So it's when you look at it, when you look at the tax base in your state, what tells you whether business like growing or just scaling through? Right. Right. Right. Perfect. Um, and of course, everyone is thinking

because it's now, uh, I've been a little close to the tax reform work going on in country. Um, So the signals we should look for, I think, the increasing volume of taxes, so both in account of tax payment transactions

and in the volume of cash collected, number one. And then two is in the mix of taxes. So you also want a situation where the broad tax base of the state is changing over time.

And that makes, you know, the state's finances non-fragile. I really liked the way Khalil phrased it, not just resilient but non fragile.

So that's it, right? And then particularly, I would look at two things. Number one is VAT because everybody comes in. So, you know, if you can get that going,

then your captor is somewhat that group in the informal sector. But two is also is on PE side, which is a good proxy for the formal, you know,

revenue based or formal business based on the state. So let me go back to the top. Volume of taxes, number of transactions, total cash collected and the mix of taxes.

and where they're coming from on the VIT side or the pay side. All right. Thank you so much. And I think a lot of people, even in this goal have all we've all, I think, have all been directly affected by the, you know,

by the consumption tax and every purchase is that we make. And so I think I really, really appreciate that response that you gave And to call her and tell her please feel free to also comment on this after call. I want to do you realize that working harder was in the answer.

They actually needed a better system, better capital or just better people. So call her I can go first things. Okay so I think so the time in my business where I was working very hard on the one I was working alone and we were making money, but we were not scaling.

Right. And one of the issue with that is because as a creative company, what we do is we spend a lot of money on equipment and equipment is in dollars like, from like 5 to 10,000 dollars in equipment from cameras and on and on.

So definitely like I knew I needed to scale why I just did not know what we would I need to get better clients. I need to walk harder. I know that by realized that what was missing was like capital rights and of course if I had Capital because it's still was there right the skills that would be there was no the

details are not available so like definitely I knew that like I needed a Capital or nothing I know I needed to was like more people because like I said I was a loan at our point right so right now my team like right now like 11 on my team so I knew that like more people small type of people that I am to. I need people who are also smart and even more creative

than I am. So I would say in just like summarize it or the shift was formed for me it was from right out of being the best worker in my company. Right. I had to not become like the person who's going to like strategize and take like that big architect basically or the company. Yeah.

I've also had to go, do you mind adding to this? Yeah, everything called us. I just brought my last week to mind. When your team starts to achieve small miracles every week, things like you as an individual,

no matter how talented or how driven, we don't have gotten done on your own. Then you know that you're doing something right. But maybe the first time this became real to me, I once it was 2018, 2019.

I was part of the team ruling out the Jeep program and the Bank of Industry. And we were at the sort of inflection point. And it was clear that the team that I pulled

off of the first wave, we needed to scale up and do things differently, because we were now going to go even further down the bottom of the pyramid,

much deeper into the informal set, but to try to get credit out. And that's very challenging work. And I will assume that we did a good job

because shortly after, as everyone knows COVID happened and we shot down, right, the whole economy shot down. But in the middle of COVID, what we had built became this really impactful tool

for getting COVID grants out to businesses so they could survive better. And so just, you know, taking the opportunity to rebuild the team in 2019 was great

because we had better structures, we had better tools, we had a much better team and it paid off very shortly afterwards. And that lesson has stayed with me till now.

Thank you for sharing that. Now our next question is for all of you, Gentlemen. So in order to... Because of our time constraint,

let's just write the answer to this. We didn't one minute. And the question is, if you had to page a foreign delegation on investing in Nigeria,

is it only one piece of up of culture? What would this be? Kaleen, please go first. I don't know. I was going to go for our proceeds, but

I've recently been introduced to this world of streamers By all these my small brothers. So I think I'll go with Shank Kamek's It's collaboration with all these types and that I should speed this stuff with the streamer university and stuff So yeah, Shank Kamek streamers, I'm not sure. All right, I'm gonna go better

So, call up please go first. Please go next. Also, I'll say like the 9dram movie industry like in total like we do export to total. We don't know.

A lot of people who will give us a 9dram like no 9dram model. Like I didn't know 9dram because of the 9dram movies. More than I would love to see is a shongoo movie. For example, it's amazing to create to be able to export nine drones or your backup

for example, out and know that. So it still goes back to even what you said, like streaming. So like, back in the day with the sales DVDs, but now like, we stream YouTube is a very big platform like, YouTube movies even do better than Netflix movies right now.

And that's because like content creators and I'm filming because I'm taking it like creating the own platform using YouTube. So I think the moving that should be a good vocal choreography. All right, time on your next.

For me, it's a debt to December. It's really interesting for now and now. I don't know that it was deliberately created, but now it's landed in our lives.

And I think it's a really unique opportunity. Also because it's a bit of a platform play, right? You can see how the unique streaming experience great in Nigeria can fit in there. You can see how food can fit in there. You can see how

movies can fit in there. It's very sort of digital native. It's very organic and sort of viral friendly as well. So I think if we can figure out how to harness that, we can almost recreate a debted December experience anywhere in the world and showcase the best of Nigeria with would be our pop culture. All right, thank you. So before I jump in and I'm just going to see the

look at the question, the comment section for questions. And I think we have one. Let's see if it's like, so we have one. I think this is for me. It says when we see a non-jantney to how does an institution like alternative bank practically empower a local entrepreneur who wants to scale we talk about the suffocating pressure of conventional interest rates.

Okay, so this is for me. We have an exciting number of products which you can check on our website at www.allbang.com. There's the alt-b's which is also perfect for avoiding environmental interest rates for just advocating.

And we also, what we do is we finance, you know, what you need to get, that's the equipment written by becoming as a partner and this helps you get what you want and most times you can just buy that offer for us and tell them. So I hope that answers your question. Thank you. So now to Taiwan, Paula, real talk. What's your relationship with that?

Do you need as a tool for growth or a trap you are avoiding? Paula, do you want to go first? I don't know if this time will go first. I mean, it's just...

Yeah. That's funny. You are very happy to go first. So for me, for sure, it's a tool.

But like every tool out there is one that you have to understand and use properly, right? But it's a tool for growth. I don't think any entrepreneur can really achieve your full potential. If they're not leveraging cheap capital, right?

and the easiest way to get ship capital is debt. Now, of course, it has to be structured right. It has to be priced right. We have to understand exactly how you want to use it,

mostly for growth phase, not necessarily for experimentation. And that's what I really like what Alt Bank is doing. You know, I know that you have several specialized products like Alt Power, Alt Mall, Alt Drive.

And for me, this is interesting now because it has a specific use case to the credit. as an entrepreneur, I don't have to think too hard. If I know I want to buy equipment and I have a great relationship with my banking partner,

I look at all business. Okay, this is exactly the best product for me. It's not a generic product. It's designed for those who are trying to buy equipment.

If I have a transportation business and I need to buy a second vehicle, it's an all-drive product. So, certainly it's true, but it's true that folks have to understand. They have to tie to a very specific use case.

Thank you so much, I will, and to learn more on all the product, some of the products, I just see all of our products as Tyreha has mentioned, please visit www.ultifankham.org to learn more. I'm very sure that the business is listening and you would find something that works

and that is to tailor me to the business requirement at this time. Now, what's the relationship between cultural confidence and economic adverts? Have you seen it play out anywhere in the world that we can learn from? This is for Carlio.

Yeah, obviously, you know, you take a look at the 80s, what the Japanese were doing. You know, shortly after the world war, these guys were decimated. They were still able to build back the economy. There was two, I think there were tops in the 80s, real estate in Tokyo was at least

for five times that of like California and so on. We've seen that there and I think even the Germans would display such a cultural confidence. And I think to bring you back to Nigeria,

I feel we have even more confidence than them in the sense that we just haven't sat down to coordinate ourselves in an economic sense. We haven't sat down to fully understand the rules

that each one of us will play across the various code sectors that we need to identify. And I think once we do that, we learn from these guys, get your manufacturing in order,

get your exports in order, understand the local ecosystem supply chains and so on and so forth. If we can get our act together, definitely, there is a correlation between cultural confidence

and economic output, especially with regards to the Nigerian context. So yeah, I think that that's it. And we're seeing it with Afrobeats.

The likes of Don Jazzy, them have done what I would call the sanitization of the music industry in terms of them using private equity, trying to actually use AI and all these things

to figure out what kind of numbers, figures, what people would listen to, and optimize accordingly, and we can see from all the hits that we use

in like Tyoh said, dirty December. And this is as a result of, you know, you doing same various, across various sectors. So I'm looking forward to that.

And I think there is a correlation with economic output on cultural confidence. All right. Thank you so much, Carl.

Tell you what, I'm also interested to hear your take on this question. Yeah. Thanks so much.

I do some work with Chinese guys. And you know, Carl is spot on like this guy is an awesome matter. They're not more hard working.

In fact, on an individual basis, they've probably not even more confident. Both at a national level, there is a concept of national confidence that they have.

And that deeply affects how they think about the economic planning, how they think about trade negotiations, how they think about sort of strengthening their economy. And you can feel that at every stage when you interact with folks.

Maybe some of it comes from history, just knowing your culture, the Chinese civilization goes back 5,000 years, Japanese civilization goes back thousands of years. And that's why cultural confidence is so important.

Because ultimately it's a means to an end, and the end in itself is national confidence. and when you have national confidence, then the way you assess your place in the world and the way you interact with the rest of the world, the way you manage your affairs, right?

It shifts. And I don't know that we have that. Maybe we had that in the 60s in the hey days right after independence, but it's something that has gone down over the time. And we have an opportunity today with the magic that's happening with the telling of our stories and our cultural treasures. We have an opportunity to bottle that into something, like, you know,

and truly transformative and shift our national confidence as a people. All right, thank you so much for sharing time on. I'm going to see you at this next question,

as to you and Kyle as well, but you can start first. What does the Machuenanger and Enterprise ecosystem look like in your blueprint? And how is it different from what we have today?

So for me, in my trial of course, system is more like set into right. I'm reliability. Like having stable electricity, for example, having good roads,

similar improvements like systems, I like what I'm calling set up all like beta because I recently just got all the people know about all. I know that so about having like an infrastructure, right?

It removes like friction and business like business for me, personally, as a creative has always been hard. I remember losing the client's wants because I wasn't able to get payment like I was able to receive payment right now We tried all payments methods. So I feel like without having that friction in business

Be so for like even like power solutions We struggle a lot to power solutions. We spend a lot of money on on transit so that so in my own blueprint I'll be I'll think like once this less friction and there's more sensitivity right things don't change like I'm not in a system where I recope to

moron the policy I've been read that just changes like everything my business has been working on so far so yes compared to what we have right now right now be the difference in my own ecosystem Thank you for that, Colleen. I'm happy to add all Banqui.

Do have an old file which sort of bridges the gap in terms of infrastructure or deficits. And so we've been able to work towards providing solutions. And there's a lot of areas that you've mentioned.

And for our listeners, you can always learn more about this by and www.alltobound.org to just know more. Now, Carlie, from a government perspective, what does the NINBIR and enterprise ecosystem look like

in your group friends? And what is it, how is it different from what we have today? Okay, I realistically speaking, we need to one be a typical system

that is united on the national vision, like Tyo mentioned. If we have a national vision, this cascades down to the subnationals, actually regional before subnationals.

You have a regional plan, and then you have a state development plan. Would this state development plan you identify? Because if you really think about it,

a lot of our states are like countries. You take the Northwest where we're from, for example, where about 16 million people. It's the same size as the UK's, the same size,

maybe the six seventh largest country in Africa and so on. So we do have that capacity in terms of human capital to actually lead if we do have the right vision. You have to have a state development plan. You have to have a sector implementation policy.

You have to have actual policies that unlock value across various growth sectors. So for example, if you have your housing, you have your MSMEs, you have your industrial plans or policies. You have things across the creative economy. Once you do that, every M game needs to be charged with some sort of task,

to implement such policies. So, my enterprise ecosystem for me would look like one that has a lot of linkages from export all the way to internal markets. Although it's the infrastructure that Kola was mentioning,

your ease of doing business policies are spot on, there is direct communication between the government and private sector. And we're here talking about the future of enterprise in Nigeria, but actually the future of Nigeria is enterprise.

And I would love to see, you know, future of work. It will stick governments, whether regionally or individually, do have stakes, minority stakes, albeit, you know, these enterprises going forward

to have some sort of national cultural confidence within the enterprises that will go global, the likes of Vietnam. I would imagine a customer still going

taking a stake in a bit and all you know to make a lot of sense or even an all bank and so so that's what it was. Absolutely also bank. So we have some questions from the in the comment section and I'm going to direct the first question to Ty will. So the question is how can we start teaching financial literacy in homes rather than just make money in an average? How can

the larger population of entrepreneurs that understand in the difference between built-in scalable companies rather than glorified self-employment. So, Ty will please help us with an answer to that. Ty will tell you Ty what can you hear us? I don't think she's on the court right now. I think maybe it was a network thing. So,

How did you want to take a stab at this? Sorry, thank you. Great question, you own time. Okay, so it says, how is that teaching financial literacy in homes rather than just to make money,

banjo and approach? How can the larger population of entrepreneurs that understand in different terms between building scalable companies rather than the glorified self-employment? I think first of all, you also understand that being self-employed, you want to start with anybody who decides to take off that journey.

Most times, even from Nigeria, it never always happens out of, oh, I need to make quick cash. I need to survive. It's a few more form.

So what that means is that, I mean, you're right. We definitely need to start teaching financial literacy, it's something like I'm also learning and I'll be learning, right?

We always came up from a hustle and struggle structure never understood, right? We never really understood what's called building a company like it is, right?

So I think what we need to do is, we start off from schools, from the young people going to the young people, teaching young people more teaching young people more about like

finance literacy literally right so it's not something that is good to help one in a day right the government has come in and I think this is where Kylie is going to know for us like government has to come in and teach like the young people more about financial literacy right most of us have to learn it on

our own or still learning you know both I think our title is yes so you can Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

All right. Tell you what, I think you missed it, but the question. The question. Call out as answering is this.

Yeah. I got the question. I got the question. I got the question.

Sorry. I had to go to the news. That's really fun. So this is an interesting question.

Because I don't know that there's an easy way to deliver that training now at home. because we have adults, parents who themselves are not particularly financially tricks. And so if the real problem is getting the next generation

to be in a much better place, then we have to ask ourselves, what's the best mechanism to deliver that to them? And I think school is important.

I think for most earlier as like, nausea, curriculum, we have to put in the elements of financial literacy. And then just continue to lay out all the way through

to kids graduate secondary school. But it's time kids are living secondary school. they should have an average, same financial knowledge.

You don't have to be an investor, but you should know what this thing's mean of say a first year entry level person going to a bank. And then the rest would, they will get over time.

Now if we absolutely are determined to get it in front of our kids at home, then maybe we look at TV content, maybe we look at online content,

maybe we'll leverage some of the streamers that Kaleo mentioned. And the guys who are getting the attention of this generation that was so concerned about,

we both are in bed and actually trust the contact into what they are showing the kids. I thank you so much for that and I'm also happy to share that you know do have something in the pipeline and there's also like we also have like existing courses as well that can help with financial literacy. So to the audience what just keep watching the altbank space we're going to announce

something that I believe is going to help with some of the financial literacy and teach as well and how to build scalable companies rather than just the glorified self-employment as was commented. Now moving on, so this is for both Kaleel and Kaleel. If you had to pick one sector when

Nigeria could feed Africa in the next decade, which one and why? Hello. Well, I thought Kala would go first. No.

What do you want to call the only go first? Yeah, I got to go first. I think, wow, like one set I think would be tourism for me. Like that's something that I've been thinking about.

I see the potential in Nigeria has like tourism, right? because this is still going to lead, right? We just need to package like we do a lot of cultural we have cultural rights we just need to package it right. We have our history we have our full web our fashion web our music web our films and just like on what I will say about like the

whole um that is the same one it goes like that's even that's just an example the potential right if you check like how much is being made in just like that's the same point right that's like what the whole country sometimes makes in the whole year like we make it in just in one or two. So like I think if we're able to focus on if we can build a infrastructure

improve security, right? I want to travel around Nigeria but like sometimes I'm scared because of like in security. So I think if we can focus on leveraging on tourism, it would be amazing. And I remember I went to Morocco in January. I mean, a lot of those music were going to January.

I would be so, we saw what the power of tourism can do. And that's also a big part of the economy rights tourism. So yeah, that would be what I think can help. Yeah.

All right. Thank you for that. The time of this question is for you. When did he had non-interest banking or asset-based finance?

And what comes to mind? And does it feel like an option for you? You know, I have been looking for your way to get non-interests financial products. Oh, you're looking for a here.

Not again anymore. Now that I know, Monday morning, I will be at an all bank location. All right. You know, when I first came to understand the element of non-interests banking, it was

It's also very clear that pound for pound, this is a much better financial product than anything else on the market. The idea that my bank and share the risk with me, the idea that I'm not tied to interest rate payments regardless of what happens to the business. It makes a lot of sense. And of course, you have economies where this is the standard, right?

Like Saudi Arabia, the Gulf Nations. This is very much the standard banking product. So for me, I think it's the most attractive option that you will find in the market.

And I encourage anyone out there who's thinking about getting a loan to really look at non-interest of an HR products. And like me, please, one day, one day,

and you should show up at our bank. Yes, and please, we'll look at it at Stellin Clas... Muhammad, a very vague CBD, Stellin Clas... And that road to Stellin, Stellin, Stellin,

So you can find us there. We're more than happy to have you, Ty all. So I mean, there are a lot of other great questions here, but I think we have about nine minutes left.

So let's see. So I'd want to ask this. What do for you investors, to misunderstand about, you know,

Nigerian entrepreneurs? And what do an Nigerian entrepreneurs to misunderstand about for a very good capital? So Ty, whoa.

and call out you could take a stab at that question. Well, I wanted to go first this time. Yeah. OK.

Thank you. So I feel like Nigerian torpedoes are seen as risky. Right? We take high risk, or like, we're also seen as informal.

Reason being is because just our nature only choice to get things done, right? And there's always that whole thing of, like, get things done quick, get things done by any means

in the necessary. So I think that's where like, if we invest those like rights, kind of misunderstand about us, what is not reckless and is just our resilience right?

And on the flip side, for Nigerian entrepreneurs who have been missing the stupid foreign capital, is it comes with governance like, so invest us, Nigerian entrepreneurs

that are not understanding, understand in for a cup that is they want like structure they want compliance they want like long term expectations right and so the gap is is just understanding each other in okay we want we want to resilience

we're very resilient right but they want structure they want compliance right so I think it's just meeting in the middle understanding what each other once and then when it all comes together, that's where real skill will help me.

Yeah. All right. Thank you. Totally agree with me. Call us at totally agree.

In the interest of adding value, I'll share a couple more that the audience can consider. How are investors often doing understand the context in which

Nigerian entrepreneurs are playing? So you're not only having to teach them about your business, You kind of also have to teach them about the industry in general and the dynamics in the industry.

So when you use capital in a certain way, they didn't understand. Or when you say you're trying to solve a particular problem, they may take for granted that it's not a big problem. But in our part of the world, it's an extremely important problem and a valuable problem to solve. And then on our side, what entrepreneurs, again, entrepreneurs who know what they're about for in capital,

is the different mix that you have, the different types of capital that are out there. And not every business is busy, frankly, for instance. There are many other ways to raise capital. And just getting smarter about what's available out in the world

would be helpful for entrepreneurs. All right. Thank you so much. I'm quite worried about working.

And I have two questions for you that I need you to answer. Like, Rauh Pity. The first one is, what's the biggest misconception for an investor's health about major and enterprises?

And how do we collect it? Very quickly, I think last year, I auditioned now in a panel address this. And I think he was quite apt. They asked Moody's Analytics to look at the risk profile of Africa across investments

and infrastructure in the last 14 years. And the rate of loss in Africa was about 1.7%. I think Latin America was 13%. Eastern Europe was about 10%.

So the risk premiums they typically demand from African investments, you know, is too high. The continent's actual performance would suggest that it's one of the world's safest investment destinations.

It's a reality that's masked by persistent negative stereotypes that we have and so on and so forth. So they need to understand that both investors and businesses are part of the solution.

And I think that's one of the major misconceptions about the African continent, I think. I'd like to thank you. And then secondly, if you could take one person

from the private sector and for some to run government agency for a year, who and why? I would do about the ongoing technology for a good amount of WISETRA and TGA.

All right, thank you. And to call that on Taiwan, if all of them call you tomorrow and set a redesign product specifically for your business type,

what would a product need to look like? Call it, you can go first. Okay, I'll say for me, it would be like a financial gateway.

Something that handles everything we want, please. support effects for international clients, for employees, CNN, and similar payment collection, payroll management. So like, reason why I'm seeing all this is because like as a business, like I struggled to like in terms of

building a system, right? More moms talking from each perspective of like not a very large scale business, right? So I would need a product that would help manage all these different parts of my company, right? In one like way I can see it. For example, like even with your whole new touch, it's

easy to add in the ear, or even I don't want to see what my touch is going to be how I'm going to pay it. Just like basically dashboard, right? That will just help. That'll just where everything in the notes show for me. So if that product

exists, yeah, we have all the ones done for sure. I mean, it would be happy to know that I've seen this listening to this. We also have multiple for businesses. So I should totally look into that.

Tyra, please look quickly. Your dream all's bankrupt. Five plus years to know. That's it.

I think everything else is great. But if we can get the 10 nodes to be longer, that would be fantastic. And the consequence of that is that setting types of businesses

just can't exist in this market. For instance, larger equipment, listen businesses. You need huge capital. You need long term 10, no, because the assets themselves

are long term in nature. And that making those available to small businesses will help their court. And we're trying to build their business and like the equipment they're saying. And so first that's a missing product in the markets today.

The pricing obviously can get better, but I think the 10 or the loan products could get longer. All right, so thank you all so much just before we go, just to spot lies that we've had. So someone's saying to never call you, saying that you're sharing amazing views, to be honest, I love it and we will adapt easily and succeed.

And so before we go, I want you all to please share, to nominate three people whose manager, according to you, think we can all learn from unless please give a shout because we have about two minutes.

Hello, you can go first. Oh, OK, very quickly, our speed on the first person. I will do some in the tricky. The governor at 35, he's the guy that

did broadband galaxy, backbones. The first guy that did solo powered stuff, he did you beg. This guy did the first housing mortgage by any state, the contributory health management systems.

He did the first free trade zones. Second person, definitely air fight. Third person, I'm going to go. Yeah.

OK. So, tell you what I'm going to call that real quickly. I think he has to do one one from you guys, because we have one minute.

All right, I would say, please let me do three and I'll be fast. I say dango take for audacity of our so-called audacity for the body of this generation for audacity. All right, Cola.

I'll say Antonio Elume Lu, Abdul Rabie, and Kimi Adityba. I'm just going to just make sure it's coming because Kimi, so once she's a woman, right?

And this is what I was saying. because like in the field in the whole Nigerian cinema and storytelling like she's done like I'm using one so yeah I'll go see it. All right thank you so much. Can you tell me? Yes we can. Thank you so much for the pilot, how you watching Chomorpe and

I did call that in Manuel and thank you all for listening. So before we go for the entrepreneurs, the enterprises, the field as in this space if you're looking for products that actually understand how you do business we have options like all power, all drive and alties, design to help you scale and get through the infrastructure

you need. We see some all fun, that energy to learn more. And really this was a really, really insightful session. I hope you all enjoyed it as much as I did. And I really, really wish we had more time. Thank you all gentlemen once again. And this series is going to be monthly at the, what I can add the last Friday of every month. So you could always come back to here more.

And this is part of a larger campaign that we have for the years. So there's always going to be special guests as a panelist, which will insights on what it means to be a Nigerian native. Thank you all once again. And also to manage our managing director and CEO, Mr Abu, the manager of the Canadian Bank.

Have a good bye everyone and thank you. Thank you very much. I do. Go bless.

Bye. Bye.

Episode 05
Consumer value

Black Friday Everywhere

A grounded look at discounts, spending pressure, and how to know when a deal is actually worth it.

01:03:59 Consumer value Open on X
Open full transcript

Good evening everybody. I hope we're all having a good day. My name is Olafisayra. I should end the album. I was for the next hour or so. I will officially kick that into conversation at 6 o'clock. So just give us a minute or so on Hang tight. Thank you all for joining early. Okay, six o'clock. I will be starting now.

Thank you again for, thank you everybody for joining once again. We're starting promptly today. So wherever you are, if it's morning, if it's afternoon, if it's evening, I hope you all have any good day. And for anyone shopping right now, I wish you a good look. Welcome to our X-face which is brought to you by the alternative bank.

As I introduced earlier, my name is Olupisayo Shidendya, I'll be your host for the next hour. Now if your timeline looks anything like mine right now, it's officially rock Friday everywhere.

Right? My inbox is screaming about 90% off. My tiller is suddenly selling TVs and there are flash sales everywhere for things that that people might need at like five minutes ago.

And you all know how it goes, now the countdown of the hype, the sense of panic, that you're about to miss the deal of the century. The 1000 NIRAP ES5s,

the 2000 NIRAP, the between shoes, all of those things that exist in the ecosystem right now. But to natural ask him, the question that really matters,

there's a block Friday everywhere, yes, but where is the real value? Where are the opportunities to actually, are there really opportunities on it?

Are these things real? I think, I think, I think it's, it's, it's fluctuated a, a, folks, real life. Are we getting authentic savings?

Are we just buying into market and TATA? Are we getting a great deal? Are we just getting caught up on the impulse buy? And because let's be honest, right?

Sometimes the discounted item will buy ends of the city in the corner reminding us of our financial decisions. To do our good thing about packing the economies behind is strategic pitfalls and what's important,

how you can shop smarter this season. But today I would not be doing this alone to help me navigate this QUT commerce landscape and people are panelists on track.

I have the brilliant committee of the new advanced tele tonight, moderate talk. I'm in the help you've got your research ready because we're about to dive into the world of it.

Price slashes and authentic value. I know right. Good evening, Fisaya. Good evening everyone. As Fisaya mentioned, my name is Ayur Miti. You know, Fisaya has you speaking. I remembered interestingly a conversation I had just yesterday with someone who got a money cane. If you know what a money cane is and you are a

lover of a fashion space, you should have a night game of how much money cane costs, even the she passed one and then she got the money came for five thousand on an e-commerce platform I wouldn't say which one and then the money came arrived and was a prototype. As she was complaining about the same guy scammed the blah blah blah blah.

I'm not going to say all the things I think so how this is called. I don't know if you must understand. Not so defense to that would be it do with the this person play. I mean that's the first thing. The second thing is I mean that deal was obviously

to be true. How can you money can cost 5,000 error? Your hour of that you're looking forward beyond that. If not only your own belly we do more than that. But anyway, so I don't think it's just about reading the fine print with higher. Even though I think that's a huge factor,

I guess we're going to delve into all of the certain points in the conversation. But please, if you're here to talk about our work that will or will not run your belly. This may not be it, but here we're talking about value, we're talking about Real deals and maybe no surreal deals or your experiences are or what you're experiencing that being and how to identify real value.

Because believe me this black Friday there are still good deals out there but a lot you know blowing anybody strong pets. So have this conversation with us today we have. have seasoned speakers or experts in the social media space and in the e-commerce space. First, we have Mr. Abdualaj Brill, also known as Royce, who is a social media strategist,

his EPR risk for a content creator, who somehow turned being online to more something or levels that are trying to break into a full-time career. He's making money from it. has a creative director feel by the gym and a whole lot of curiosity.

It keeps whipping up and engaging stories that not only inspire people to think, to create, but to not feel also occasionally get left out loud. So Roy to be our first speaker, besides you want to introduce our second speaker. So, don't we?

I used to hear my memory. Loud and clear for sale. Okay, awesome. Our second speaker is Godwin Fion.

He is an e-commerce marketing expert. Gaining. So Godwin is especially standard developed manager with strong experience

in marketplace group, vendor management, and utility for mass platforms. What he has done is that he's helped scare multiple online platforms by driving vendor position

for being up in them, improve their product performance, and of course, implementing data-driven strategies today. What Godwin will be bringing to this conversation is perspective on what the future of the commercial Africa is,

and how we can benefit from its practical insights in terms of market-based growth, customer experience, and digital products strategy. Some really is your good to guy in terms of,

how to make you feel good as a customer, and you'll be on earth in some truths and meets behind, the tactics that employ that the commercial platforms or should I say, retailers today use

to bait all your buyers into their food. So thank you and welcome to the conversation, God way. I think I would like to before we before, go and see how I'd like to just emphasize the fact that

to this, this exercise is taking a different turn. And we are trying to expand it, right? And cut see all the model we are introducing gift shopping vouchers for the season for the top five participants in today's conversation. So if you are thinking that it is going to come here to the same.

Well, in my one, so we think that strategy and probably starts to engage by sending in messages in comments section. And just really engaging with the conversation throughout would have people monitoring. the conversation who would let us know before the end of the session. We'll be talking about winners,

I will be announcing the winners before we go. Exciting times. I would like to start the conversation with, I think Godwin is still here.

I think we're waiting, we're waiting for the rise to join the call. But for Godwin, Godwin, Godwin can you let us know from

an e-commerce and market-based standpoint, what actually determines whether Black Friday, the usual value of just cosmetic discounts. Hi, you're in the room, but you're doing it for sale.

We do know you're meeting. Accomplish everyone else on the call. So if I could just take your question again, say them what actually determines whether

a Black Friday deal is real, or if it's cosmetic. So for me, I like to highlight three things to be honest. The first is the price history.

Second is the product demand. And third is the margin transparency I've explained. Now for price history, I think customers are now beginning to latch onto this come that goes on.

Well, I'm not necessarily calling this come. But call it price adjustments. Where before any of the sale events happens, vendors quickly adjust the price to make it appear real.

So when event.cleans that is offering 50% of the question now, now we access 750% of what actually, is it the baseline price that has existed for the past two months?

Or is it the adjusted price that happens? So first thing that makes a Black Friday deal really is that the price history wants to be sure. And the discount you are giving on your item,

is it actually on the discount on the price has always been there or is this new fabricated price that you just added to make it give a sense of discounts and the next is product demand and when people only shop for black variety they actually want to shop for something that they need and over time we've noticed that what customers get

discounts on and actually products that they do not actually need so perhaps these are products that a vendor has that are old stock. They're not really moving, they need to upload. So customers get on the landing page of a Black Friday sale and

disappointed because what they're expecting to deal on is not exactly the exchange of that day. So that's the second thing. And then the third thing is a college margin transparency. What it means is customers need to reduce the expectations, to be honest.

Now there is a market price that is generally acceptable across all industries. You can expect to buy certain things for certain amounts, maybe plus 20% higher or 20% lower. For instance, if a vendor is selling a phone, the margins are usually not very high on

electronics like phones. So let's say there have 10,000 era extra on that phone, just a sell it off. And my true vendor would only be able to offer maybe a 5,000 era of or 6,000 era at most. And when the vendor claims to be offering 50,000 era discounts for a phone, and it's

most likely it's a lie. And because if he's doing that, he will not be able to be profitable. I mean, you're not able to keep his business running. My gender transparency would mean that this vendor's

unrealistic is 60% or 50% discount on phones. I mean, not really be true. And you should raise questions. It makes more sense if it's just 10 to 20% I believe.

And this is the education that we, we ask customers now needs to begin to understand that on certain items, it might not necessarily be totally believe it if we start giving discount of 90 to 80% and so if I could just

say cool back that and what makes a Black Friday review is that first the price history is consistent and what we are getting this content prices on prices that have actually been there for at least two months 60 to 90 days and then the product that I demand is what customers are expecting to get it

price-lash on not just on anything you want to clear out of your stock and then Let's imagine transparency be realistic. I don't know how much I've been able to answer that question You've answered it beautifully actually. Thank you And I'm just very excited that you did mention the price last thing so we know is looking our heads

Those are both a shopping deals online. We know that we saw this price It was this this this sneakers was 50k two weeks ago watching one single how calm this neck is is now How 55,000 during Black Friday stills? I tell you me that is 25% off.

So thank you for that. My next question, B2roys, could you confirm that you are on the call now in New York? So I don't think is,

I don't think is ever as sticky yet, but so maybe we can just keep engaging, go to really handy when we're able to come, I mean, you know, connect with lawyers.

And if anybody has any questions So ask perhaps you could just also just indicate by short points and probably give you an opportunity to speak and share your thoughts.

I hate it. Thank you. Also to mention again that there are five, 10,000 Arab vouchers, shopping vouchers available.

So your engagement is not quarter enough just because tonight. Of course we love to hear your voice but that is about our not,

but it's actually something to do and engage. So, God, when I'm going to ask you the next question, then an e-commerce expert in your experience, what would you say as some of the challenges?

Because I mean, let's face it, when if you want to talk about the consumer's challenge where Black Friday deals are all that's what sales are concerned, we can list it to tomorrow,

but we sometimes don't know the backend of things. So what are some of the challenges that e-commerce platforms also face, during deals or sales periods like flood Friday,

which is a major one, logistics, vendor behavior, even customer expectations which you mentioned and how do these things affect real value for the shopper? Did you get my question?

Yes, I did, I really thank you very much. I guess I'll just speak to some of the things you mentioned and you mentioned logistics earlier. One of the biggest problems,

the ECOMAS firms, first during the Black Friday, is having to manage customer's expectation as it concerns Black Friday. Many customers leave it late to be honest.

Some people order something for the beloved one on the night of the 24th, and expect it to be delivered 25th to Monium. Many ECOMAS companies,

and I think all ECOMAS companies have logistics timelines, SLEs, if it's a Lagos order, It's probably going to take about two to four business days to be delivered. Now, there can be exceptions.

Where priorities are placed on certain items just to have it delivered. Now, imagine everyone around the country wants items to be delivered immediately. And as they brand up prioritizes customers at this faction, we want to make every customer happy.

And what it means now is there's a rush, especially somewhere like Lagos. I guess during the festive season, everybody trying to get to the same place at the same time. And so there's a lot of pressure on the logistics companies because it is not just one e-commerce company that employs them.

A lot of what are people are using their Instagram vendors, vendors from the market, from the open market, trying to send something to their customers at that time. So there are a lot of delays, there's cancellation and delivery, people are asking for reforms or I'm disappointed that gift support I've got into my wife is an industry gift.

So the crisis just a lot doing that time. So we have a lot of logistics training. Again, one of the things I think can affect is, because it's the festive season,

and Black Friday comes at the time when everybody's buying something. And I don't think it's new that's not everybody shops online. And some people are going to the open markets

to buy directly from these vendors who have their product listed online. And if it's a product that is in demand, and because e-commerce companies only serve

as a bridge between the vendors and the customer, there's only so much we can do as a consensus stock control. And what this means is, a vendor can say I have 50 humpback packs in my shop ready to be delivered.

And he lists that product on a platform like AutomoldersNG and says, I'm ready for Black Friday. I'm giving it discount of 20% on every humpback that you buy from me. Now I'm very in mind that this vendor also sells offline and so

in customer mass rushing now what of my sales fast I got this from here and then everybody rushing down to the shop to pick it up. As at the time when for that's a computer and an e-commerce platform and then and we reach out to the vendor and then the vendor sees oh I'm sorry it is out of stock. Now we cannot control that. Why would there can be um next

ship preparations to have some of the stocks available. There is only so much we can do. And in that case, there is a need to source for this items elsewhere.

Now, what this means also is because the conversation on these counts with the new vendor we are sourcing from was not there. This vendor is going to charge the price he wants to charge.

Or less than the normal market stand that price that doesn't have the 20% discount. What this means is in managing the situation as an e-commerce company reach out to the customer and see, oh, there is a changing price.

Customers are like, oh, I don't believe you guys. You guys are calm. You guys are frauds. She said you're going to give me 20% and make full payment.

I want my item or you respond to me. So again, this is one of the very things that we expect to get. Now, for instance, finally, I've just become one more thing. For instance, on OATMO, we are promising up to 80% discounts.

Now, in the frenzy of the excitement, everybody takes the attempt to read and says it is up to 80%. And the discount being offered is not necessarily 80% across all platforms. So, customer has come in that rush and say, well, you guys are saying you're offering

80% discounts. It is true, we eat at the same discount on select few items that we need to extract partnership with certain brands and vendors to provide this item at that discount at price. However, not all of the items would be 80% definitely.

And so, customers are like, oh, you guys are calm. You promise, 80% but what I'm seeing is just 15% and so although e-commerce is green and I'm sure the acceptance is getting better. Customers are becoming more knowledgeable but this has more of the issues as an e-commerce frame that we face, especially doing Black Friday.

Okay, so I think, Hi Royce, thank you for joining the conversation. I see that there's a hand up as well of Debson. Just give me a chance to engage Royce quickly and I'll come back to you because just leave your hand up if it's intentional and I'll take you a question as soon as Royce is done speaking.

So, we write our lecture now. So, before we came on, we were spoken about it. There is a lot of brain to everywhere, right? There is a lot of, if you sleep on, we call it public,

we find black variety of data that are done by your people, or in place of your sleepers. So, from your experience, how much of this excitement is actually real value? So how much of it is just pure market in Seattle?

Hi, Fisaya. Thank you for your question. Yeah, to answer your question. I think majority of the plug-fry thing is just markets and pure markets.

And for my experience, that is because most of the discounts are no real. They're not discounted really. They're just a way to market the food and to get people to shop from them.

God, do you agree with this? Because I think he's more business. This seems like... Is it true that it's not real?

No, I'm not saying everything. I'm saying most of it. Okay, so there are platforms like like God needs all small that what they say is what they mean Yes, there are platforms like that. It's most definitely

Okay So just before before before I go to Epstein quickly Yeah, this so let's tell us right Nigerians are calling out the big black party this country online How big is social media today expose the you know in the game this?

You know, misinformation in terms of the price, the price tactics. There were not any limits in any way, but see it's just, it is what it is to be honest. It is marketing and people who shop if they like what they see. And if they don't like what they see, they wouldn't shop.

So it's just what it is. I mean, just today alone, I think I've seen multiple posts about people complaining that's the product that it was since last year on Black Friday that they haven't received them. So if you know that your company, if you're on this column,

come with one of those companies, please fix up and give it a real value. Can the host please give absent opportunities to ask ask their question okay I strongly don't okay all right so

again I'm getting ready to announce the first set of winners so if you know you are not engaging please go ahead and do so now and we would of course speak an

and announcement as shortly so by a misdemeanor, but I, the first winner of probably another world about six that three. So if you're not engaging, please go ahead

and do so on the road. Another first, very first winner of the shopping voucher cut here all 12 in eight minutes. Amity, do you want to...

So yeah, actually have another question for Roy's based on his response to your question. So let me just say this is just in by the way comment anyway from what boys are said and from what God we are saying is very clear that our

voice is for the people is for the people buying and God really is for the people that are selling me. So depending on the side that you are on just know that there's somebody for you on this call and the idea is the air views. Please you can raise your hand to join the conversation outside of

just typing in the comments who would love to actually hear of boys and hear what you think. If I tell you the number of scum that I've seen on Twitter today or on X today when it comes to the idea of Black Friday and Silo, but let me ask you my question of combat. Hi, Royce. So I'm not going to go back to what you do. I'm just going to say

based off your experience on what you do. How do you think that brands can better communicate, for instance, let's let's drive from what God being said using all mobile instead. They are offering to 80% discount. The word of to a day, and he said some people will not redefine friends and it will cost for Hala. Right? So in that same context, you think as a way

for brands to better communicate authentically, you know, the value that you are offering during black Friday in a way that will not mislead your customers. Yes, most definitely. I think there's a way that can do that. Hi, I'm you. Sorry. Yes.

So, right. Yes. So, right. Yes.

So, you can't wait to get back to the next slide. Yes. So, we want to communicate value, right? Without misleading customers, without saying, I know you, it's not our fault.

We said, well, we said, are you decided to understand what you understood by it? You know, setting brands are telling me to be big wordings, right? to communicate certain deals so that they have a look for to escape. Thankfully, Godwin as a children that's

optimal is not like that, right? But we know brands like this online. So I'm saying, for brands that want to do better and take

dressing like this higher advice, for what ways can you suggest that they do that? That they communicate the value that we create without misleading? Well, the only way is to do what Godwin says,

I am out bank does, to just give it to the people as it sees, You know, to just it's the fact so anyone who is coming to shop knows what they are coming for and if you like what you see You get what you see and if you don't you just leave it

So it's just better to be real with it. So people would know what they are coming for. I won't feel like they can scam the anything I Yeah, I think I'll see the flow to go to the industry. God, how do you think, just let's reverse that question.

Right. One, and you can answer it. I know you were spoke to it earlier, but we can have a side of the beat.

How do you think marketers should be able to communicate sometimes or just clarity so that people can get a better understanding? Because I mean, the social media process

a wash right now which complains about purchasing it product and not getting the actual automatic purchase and the defense for most sellers is always with the fine print. At what point does the reading defense not become enough of a defense for marketers? and you're still away, they're away in the market are hard so you can

enhance our mobile perspective. Okay thank you very much. So this is what this is what we've tried to do. I speak as one who is also through the customer, not just the vendor and without the customer as it's impossible to run business.

And so what innovative platforms like ours are trying to do in this time and I still now have sit down conversations with people who are actually interested in providing true discounts for the customers. What this means is we are making it a bit more curated not to just open up the platform

and say, everyone on the platform, go ahead, this black Friday, go ahead and listen to know. So we are creating the setting criteria that are looked at over the years, over the past when you're doing business with us as a vendor, as a brand.

We want to see your history of sales, how you be able to fulfill all those, how you've addressed customer complaints after sales history.

Those are certain criteria that are very important before you come on as a vendor or as a brand on the Black Friday deal. And then what this also means is we now have special conversations.

And over the time of your sales, this is what we have seen that you have done with us as a business. These are top-selling products.

products that customers are quite intrespading. We want discounts on these items. There is no need to be about the boost. So, Xiaomi Dia is a lot of many reviews of customers that have complained about the Black Friday series not telling the true margin of what it is. And as a brand that cares, you cannot close your ears to these things. We see them every day. And so, we are

engaging with stakeholders with partners. For instance, in this current Black Friday, where we have have done is what you see is what you get. We try to streamline the products that are truly discounted to make it easy after customers to find it.

Let's be truthful here. It is impossible to have discounts on all of the products and the platforms. If you are on the other side of running an e-commerce company, you'll be sure that they're quite a number of products that are listed on the platform.

game. When you just read blanket and see every product and plus of his discounted, no, that's not true. So we take advantage of specialised campaigns, customised London kgs, special discounts to use work customers can click and lead them to a particular place. We had

discounted products of the incubator based on discussions of its vendors and brands that are truly interested in giving discounted products. So again, I shared the sentiments of Roy's that a lot of customers just think yes, it is not true. Most of them, yes, but now the

narrative is now being corrected and we are gradually reducing our number of most. So now if you, for us, we also in this call, we work the talk, we put our are moderate toakis. If we say something is truly discounted, we are not trying to get customers to coming and shop with us on that, with theatrics or deceptive know that's not

to go here. The goal is to truly provide customers with what they really wanted. So what we do is we do some of these and what are you expecting to buy at this time for the Black Friday deal. As a customer that's been shopping with us for over a year, what are things that should be excited when you find that I've been discounted.

And then we take this feedback and have discussions with stakeholders and say this is what the customers are requesting. And this will be able to close the gap as to what is true and what is deceptive.

So make sure that customers actually get what they want on the platform that actually discounted. Thank you, Godwin. I think I'm pleased to announce, I promise that would be

announced in the first one, I think that we said that exactly 60. And I'm pleased to announce that our first winner, don't buy the bet you have been the best person to actually comment on the page. It's Crystal Star. So Crystal Star congratulations would be reaching out to you with information

to guard your gible's voucher. It's crystal stuff here, and then if you are a congratulations. And next person, I think I would just like to ask

generally, I would like to say this. So if anybody can tell me the history of Black Friday, you'd also get a free voucher. And what I would like to hear if it was Black Friday start,

what's your, what's your, Once the data was bigger, it was the worst thing you experienced around Black Friday. What was that thing? Naturally, probably, we all remember that we had, of course, any best person to speak.

I would like to get Royce's experience first and then, you know, the best person to speak would also get a three-year batch, I could see all those moments. So Royce, tell me what's your, what's your most memorable Black Friday experience? I've never been a fan of Black Friday for a long time now because the first time I tried

shopping, I realized that this is nothing. It's like, it's just a marketing ploy to get me here. And after that first time, I've just always detested Black Friday. Like this is where I'm fighting for the people.

That's why I'm in my own people now. Thank God, I don't have words, but no comments, right? We agree with my new people. But are you serious?

One experience I never tried again. What do I see? Do you want to try this dark Friday? So you can come back and share with us.

Who knows? Of course. To roll. My perception has changed since this space.

God will turn you into a believer. I love it. Okay, so I'm going to have to make me on. Okay.

When you want to share share something, how do we do? How do we go to a mutual framework? Okay, and why should Bob do what to do that?

I hear there's some pretty interesting comments being made in the child. I can't really see that. So I'm not going to change it.

What's that? Okay, I will. Let me about two of them. And then there's a question from Dawn Sore.

So we take that as well. Great if I says, I'm loving this space, that phrase makes the motion for me. Some brands are honest and some aren't,

isn't that the truth, isn't that the truth? Some say someone says that it does say it can do something to be mentioned by the buyer, that is, so we are not going to be

practiced to the brand in any body, but feel free to mention them in other spaces on your timeline. But I think I get why that it absorbs the dimensions.

So the other people don't fall. Should I eat the word free now? But yeah, I'll leave that to your personal judgment. Let me take Don's last question before the next comment.

So Don's also says, sorry, I think I just lost the, yes, what is the best way and solution to address the cost of mass concern and how do companies demystify the fears?

So I think God win will be in a better space to answer this question right, Messiah. They got win here the question. Yes, yes, I did. Yes, I did. So I think that question was from Don. So Mike, what's the best way and solution to address customers, the customer's concern and how the

companies demystify the fear as a customer centric company and especially me I'm very pro customer. So one thing we try to do, first things to increase customer knowledge. This is why we have species like this so that we can have one-on-one interactions and so that we do not think that companies are on barrobots. They are currently run by people who care,

who want to hear concerns and again, customer knowledge when we continue to educate customers on how Blackfied neurons and what they can expect. Again, I think currently the best way or the most effective way that people have now accepted to get feedback on any disgruntled customer or any I think that was delivered that is defective.

It's the commercial media and tanked brands, accorded them out. Many times you have people on the other end when customers, deliveries are made, when you interact with any of this brand, they are always support lines to allow

these customers to reach directly to us so that we can address these constants. Again, I do not blame customers, it's usually when they told these channels, perhaps the feedback I did slow or their concerns are not addressed as quickly as possible

and sometimes they've turned to dragging the brand online before they can get the issues resolved. Again, it is not a flash in the pan, it's not something that we can address in one day. The evolution of the e-commerce piece puts pressure on each of the companies is why involved in running this daily commerce business

to improve the processes. And if there's any business that cares, one thing that we do is to consistently take customer's feedback and treat it.

And so these days, they are setting things that have been put in place such like product gets, that gets after sales complaints on its like twice or three times gets toned off, the vendor gets flagged.

If it happens again, that's to get toned off. This measures are put in place because when a customer buys, when a customer buys from an e-commerce platform, they do not care about the vendor.

They don't want to know if it is this vendor that's so digital new or if it is this brand that's so digital new. All they know is they're dealing with a company they buy from. And so in a bit to also protect our image

and be able to continue business. One thing that we have now tried to do as a business is to now begin to take strict measures on vendors who drop the ball.

So when customers complain or after sales resolution take longer times to be done, because customers are the other end that are irates and this ground suit, we put disciplinary methods into the situation that these vendors who are causing all of this bad reputation to the brand are addressed.

So again, the only way customers can that we can address, to just speak to don't show my curious question, the only way we can address customers' constant is to keep improving processes by getting this feedback. And so I believe spaces like this should not just be

once in a year. We need to have more spaces where we interact with the face with customers where we can ask the questions. We can take these concerns at feedback and going into our processes and do better. Thank you. Thank you so much. God really. I have it. I have it great Caesar and maybe maybe I'm really

what do you think? What's an answer my brain says against the power chat? Absolutely.

Operate. Okay, the first person with the correct answer, even if I don't think there's a correct answer, I'll help my brain

to them. If a TV was 300,000 in October, increased to 380,000 in November, then And slashed to 300,000 on black Friday.

What's really happening? A, 16% genuine discount. B, 6.7% genuine discount. C, 6.7% price increase from the original.

And D, 26.7% genuine discount. Who knows the answer? I'll tell you that again. The TV was 300,000 ARI in October.

It increased with 300,000 ARI in November. They slashed to 300,000 or 20,000 on Black Friday. What's really happening? A, 16% genuine discount.

B, 6.7% genuine discount. C, 6.7 price increase from the original. And D, 10, 6.7% genuine discount. We have any answers.

You have to be comments section. Hello, good evening. Yeah, I can hear you. Tell I is my name.

Oh, 100%. I said, tell I is my name. You now call me name. I do 90.

I apologize. Yes, I apologize. So I want to now to make some comments on the last question you asked that, how do we diversify customer concerns

during Black Friday? I don't know if I can still make some 30, 45 seconds. Yes.

So I think for me, based on the experience of the Black Friday, I think the first thing we need to do is to clarify what is happening before the rush begins. Often then not when we don't clarify,

we are not setting expectations so all the customer comes in with the different expectations and once that happens, it becomes a nightmare for the people planning Black Friday.

So I think we have seen it more. I mean, the bet is that you clarify what is happening before the rush begin. So everybody got money, the expectation at that time.

Then I think I don't think that works. It's that while the process is on, we should communicate and we will try it throughout the day. So if things are not working well,

if things are of us on the track, they are issues, they just communicate during the day. And now that one, we need to show empathy at every touch point.

You know, empathy is one of our core values. So it means that we should acknowledge the delays where there is a long queues of system issues, whatever we are, we just keep communicating

that customer will know what is happening, because when customer can see our phone most, they get frustrated, I'm gonna get frustrated, they go,

they start dragging us, and then the customer damage is very, very high. So again, I've not done that. One of the things I want you to not do

is that we should make it very, very easy to get help, where people are struggling, where they are to pay out or to do anything. that's our L% or what we call our service center on that day.

That'd be proactive and then responsive. So, and the last point is always about that pricing and the product. So let me make sure that pricing and products are correct.

So there's no one this. At the end of the day, when it wants to be, it becomes different. I think those are my few cents that I want to ask.

And thank you very much, well done. Thank you. Okay, thank you so much, Taylor, for your contribution. You're most welcome.

We have a winner. I am the one to announce our winner for the question that I asked. Absolutely, but I need a comment.

Before I announce the winner. I am one of the city comments still. I know that I can still agree when I'm on the street unfortunately.

I don't know if it's the first street. Someone said that the auction is TV's faulty. Yeah. Yeah.

That is very nice. Sorry. You know, you know, you know, you know, the situation is where you have

there's no wrong answer. I'm only 50 most correct answer. All right. You know what I think?

You want to disclose this to your client. Yeah. I'm sorry if you've experienced somebody We have to set in you a television.

Now, as far as the other discount price, we are apologize to you. But the answer to the correct answer is C. And everybody, who is the winner?

All right. So for option C, give me a minute. winner, there's olamide. Olamide chose option C. I'm not sure enough.

I think the first response that came in for option C was a marker. Yes, correct. That's a marker. Yes, that's correct. The more simulations you want, the winner of the 10,000-hour voucher, let's see, all tomorrow. I have another question. But before before I send the question,

Emily, I take a big question in the comment section for our speakers, even though I can take this question. So someone asked that one of us because goes over the response again on what we think, what do you think that consumers can do? I think if you take take the next thing, I can find the comment again. Yes, but the question is,

comment. Yes, I found it. So the person says lost in the ABCs. I don't quite get Royce replied to that question. Can you come again? The question about what consumers should do? Okay. So, hi Royce, did you get that? Hi. What question was that? So, I believe we had asked the question about, which I

question was that was it so how yeah so we had the question what consumers what what other consumers you know live above or you know rise

up the clickbait of all the juice it is come really right how how do other they see truly clutter right do you get that although I

think the question the question was talking about the question Roy's address was how brands and better communicate without misleading customers. And then in answer, yeah, in answering that, Roy has mentioned some things about what the

consumer can also do. So, Roy, if you're just taking a response again for the sake of lasting diabetes, thank you. Okay, so what consumers could do is to just If you go on the site or wherever you're shopping, you will eventually see the deal that they are offering.

So if you like what you see, the code for it and if you don't like what you see, you disengage. I think that's what I said concerning that part when I was answering the question. Okay.

Thank you, Royce. But, you know, in buying and liking what you see, I want you to see. Always remember to be safe. Remember that the GCS deal in the moment does it make it true for authentic?

Always take time to do your own personal findings about your density and the credibility of the platform that you're buying from. which is going to lead me to my next question. Now, if you want to buy a new phone on Black Friday,

but spread payment over a few months, instead of paying everything to date, which option makes the most sense. I'll take that again. If you want to buy a new phone on Black Friday,

but spread payment over a few months, instead of paying everything to date, which option makes the most sense a borrow from three friends and all of them. be swipe random credit card and hope for the best.

See, use your buy-in-mouth filter option on all sport of NG or D. The D here, I think I'm going to change it to collect your partners credit card and pay.

What's the right answer? That's the right answer to this question. Again, you send your responses via the chat and what announce the next speaker.

So we're not the next to win our other. I'm I'm ready. Over to you. Yes, for science.

So while we wait for that, I want to go and win as well to well, for our response. I want to go and answer the question that Roy's just answered.

But I wanted very simplified. You know how when you are saying, oh, yes, how to start off your smartphone in three easy steps, that kind of answer.

Yes. So how can I as a shopper who does not want to get a money came prototype instead of an actual money came?

How do I identify or verify genuine blood Friday deals? Blood Friday is coming now on to shop because I have things in my cart. very easy and simple with identify genuine deals.

All right, thank you, I'm Edie. And so for this question, Pamedi, did they cut my max? And that's one who speaks from an e-commerce, you must speak like the customer who wants to translate in shopping experience because I shop too.

So one thing I do is where before the sales starts, the best time to check for what you want to buy is no way in the sales starts. It's actually before the sales starts. So you can have the view of what to expect and what discounts the e-commerce companies are actually offering.

And then also, I'm one who does the put my eyes on the discounts. I'm looking at the price. If you're offering a 30% discount, how does it show up on the price? because if I've checked what I wanted by earlier

and I've had it in my cart or in my wishlist, then when the discount is finally applied, I can look at the layer, so I'm looking at the price. Looking at the price tag.

Where my eyes on the discount, my eyes also on how much of this discount affects the price because I don't want to pay too much for something that I can actually pay lesser.

I can also read reviews, okay? Yeah, I can look at reviews. I can check especially when you product on the show or on display or on the landing page. I want to be sure that I'm not just buying because the price is right. And so I really need it. Actually, that's one question people really need to ask. And also, are you buying from

what do I use now from someone that has a brand that has social proof and makes it easy for you to buy. I'm not just about to jump in on every platform that offers it discounts to just buy. This is where reviews are worth of mouths

and what do people have to say about a platform that they have actually shopped from. One also thing I do finally is and I'm sure everybody who shops

on any commerce platform does this. I compare prices. So I go across the commerce platforms to see if, again, you want to be sure that you are getting the best deal.

And so I go across all the platforms all free means actually true. And they're giving me discounts as compared to all these other different and e-commerce platforms

that are available. So we should save you distress and should make you get discounts that you're truly looking for.

I hope I help someone. Absolutely. Good way. Thanks.

I have so many things to see, but I'll keep it to myself. my inner circle on how to crush this black Friday because we are shopping. This I have humans who are now in South Africa.

So the winner is, I wish there was a lot of problems on the camera. What we know of the thought winner today is O-D-G. O-D-G is, I don't even know if this is the sign, but it's at cost X O-D-G. So that's the winner today.

So congratulations to Tim original to you with information on your old module. I have one more question and then we will be doing a final reward of. So we are now doing a lot of same time when I was doing all the fourth question and also the active and the active present in the comments section was an engaging the most.

So the last question on my side would be excited. Who's excited? I was scared. I was so excited.

I was so excited. Which of these sounds, which of these sounds like the most responsible flag flag anymore? If you always go through twice, not testimony.

Now, think that again. Which of these sounds like the most responsible flag flag anymore? If you always go through twice, not testimony.

V, I'll just buy it because it's 70% off. C, I'll shop on all the model NG compared prices and use binoculars for the big stuff. D, I'll buy now and think later.

So I'll think that again, which of these terms I just want to block by the move? A, if you're a good street fighter testimony, B, I'll just buy it because 70% of C,

I'll shop on all the model NG compared prices and use vinyl paletra function for the big star G, our vinyl I think later. While we, you know, with to get the winner of the answer,

I think I'll just ask our speakers for their last thoughts and since TELA is still a speaker. So when we just go round quickly, so in less than a minute,

Royce, we take it in this order, Royce, then tell her then go to it. Thank you. Where's I there?

Yeah, I'm here. What's the question? Just give us your final thoughts. You know, what's your admonition for this season?

Oh, well, I see everyone should show up smart. And that she took note of the teams that I've been giving in this piece, especially for Godryne. This last answer that I gave for customers while shopping,

compare prices on different platforms and check the prices before and then while you're shopping for the Black Friday and yeah use old bank. Thank you guys. Tell her. All right. Thank you. I think I would take it off over way the last speaker and please show with old bank is reliable. However in the middle of

madness there must be sanity, the letters be too greedy, they shine our eyes when we are banned from Black Friday. Thank you. All right, God we. All right. So just it is the presence of the fake actualy mrs. And original. That some of the Black Friday deals been shown across platforms, simphic, and doesn't mean there's not an original. And for me,

and not all small one thing we tried to do is to make Black Friday every day and this means we are unable to save up money enough to buy outright a night in. I can use the old mall option to pay small small and I show that Black Friday still works out for me and I'll just leave us with that. Thank you very much for

having me on this call. Okay. I am ready. Do you have a hoveness ready? Yeah, I do. I sure do. So, I think there's something interesting.

Sorry. Go ahead. Okay, so for your last question, are we there?

Is that an adrenaline rum roll? Okay. I'm fine. I am fine my best. We know you use Zata 25, so congratulations at Zata 25.

You just won yourself a 10,000-year shopping voucher on old mall. Then for our most active recent after tonight, interesting, she's almost engaging. All right, she's like, she's almost engaging.

Let's go for tonight. at Tp, the congratulations at Tp, you have won yourself a shopping, free shopping voucher or more.

Congratulations to our listeners, these vouchers are, until we know specifically, these vouchers are cut to the old small slash old bank to do like one of us because it does show

with greed to be a shopping. I won't say more than that. It's a desire. I mean, thank you to everybody

for taking the time to be here. We're really honored that you gave us part of your time and the segment to just engage with us. And look out for the promises to help our conversations

spread from us to ask the most provoking questions. And of course, we'll draw a message to keep giving this flow. Thank you, everybody, and happy to be wonderful shopping experience this week.

Thank you, everyone. Have a lovely evening. Chop it your eyes up a new. Bye!

Episode 06
Cashless schools

How Cashless Technology Is Changing School Life

How digital payments are changing school routines, family planning, and the way students handle money.

01:02:11 Cashless schools Open on X
Open full transcript

Good evening everybody. Can you please confirm that you can hear me? Okay. Thank you very much. Thanks everybody for joining this session. You're welcome again to another one of our X spaces. So this conversation is going to be particularly interesting because it's going to to change or redefine how we all kind of think about our childhood or remember our childhood.

For me, it's very nostalgic topic that I'm going to be exploring today. And I'm happy to be joined by amazing speakers with the world of experiences. First of all, I will be introducing the topic which is how cashless technologies change in school life.

I remember being a young secondary school student and we had so many experiences that's probably technology could have helped solve. And then hoping that by the end of this conversation

we'll be able to probably explore how things have changed or how things are changing and how we can best work together to adopt even more innovative technology to actually reshape our society and make things more

seamless. First of all, I'll be introducing to my co-modulator who is a brand-stow retailer at your tentative bank. Thanks, thank you for being a part of the conversation.

I'm Edie. Hi, good evening. Can you hear me? Yes, we can.

Awesome. So you know when you talked about second-year school experiences, experiences. I vividly remember being in a government junior college and all my allowances were dependent on my head house mysteries or guardians, benevolence. And at the end of

the deal, whatever she took, my parents was the truth. If she told them I spent 10,000, for example, in a week, even if I only spent two kids, that was the truth. So there was no transparency and there was no reason getting my money. So I'm very excited that all of This is stuff that tech is changing.

And of course, like you said, because I was joined by really amazing speakers for today. So I will just quickly introduce our speakers. First, we have Mr. Brian Malalikon,

who is a visionary leader on the driving force behind CFL training services limits that it has a deep passion for professional development and commitment to excellence.

And Onda is leadership is confident into a trusted provider of globally recognized applications across Africa, the US and the UK. Then we have Mr. Ingebastanly,

who is a multi-faceted product leader and executive motivator. Shaping how technology drives education, which is part of what we're talking about today,

finance and opportunity across Africa and beyond, becomes with over six years of experience in EdTech and strong foundation in FinTech as well. He built his first EdTech platform in 2019

and has gone on since then to do some very, very amazing things. One interesting thing for me about Stanley is that it has over 40 certifications and product management and marketing.

So this is someone who is obviously very committed to learning and you'll be bringing in his technical expertise and his knowledge to this conversation. Then we have Mr. Iluo Patrick Gokichi-Kuru,

who is a passionate educator. as you would find when you start talking, he's dedicated to helping his students learn and grow, and he has years of experience and school management.

And last but surely not the least, we have Ulubuk-Khalas Salami, who is an accomplished professional and a passionate advocate for processes, automation, business transformation, digital innovation.

She comes in over seven years of experience in the banking and finance industry, and a wealth of experience in driving professional efficiency.

So she's going to add the alternative bank and she needs strategic initiatives focused on the business processes and how to improve the business about the security system. So that's all in for a very rich conversation with diverse experiences across the different

angles that this particular topic leads us. So yeah, I look forward to having a conversation and we look forward to hearing your thoughts in the comments and your questions. And please feel free in the cause of this conversation

to share the link and the expace on your timeline and with your network. Play them be a part of this conversation. Parents need to be here.

School administrators need to be here. And really anybody enthusiastic about how tech influences lifestyle needs to be here. So yeah.

So thank you. That's that. Thank you very much, I'm Edie. And just a few housekeeping rules before we start a conversation in earnest that our

dis-lapse your mind, our speakers to please keep the responses brief to each of the questions so that we can have a well-rounded conversation on everybody. I actually guess the chance to contribute holistically. I would also be encouraging everybody who is listening. So please Please feel free to contribute either by raising your hands and will give you the opportunity

to speak or by sharing your questions via the comments, the chat room and we will be directing your questions to the speakers as necessary. So my first question goes to Patrick. Patrick, I'm curious to know, so rather Mr. Brian, sorry, pardon me.

I would like to understand the, when we say cash education, I think we've been a lot of things, right? Are we talking about digital convenience? Are we looking at how the system is being changed completely

about how people, public and associate value and trust? What exactly is the concept of it? And what exactly is the challenge of it as well? in terms of how adoption can probably be done.

All right. Thank you very much for this opportunity. Good evening once again to everyone. It's great.

It's a great pleasure joining in this kind of conversation. Having to drop insight and talk about the cash debt, the energy, and changing school life. Hope you can hear me.

Yes, we can, sir. Oh, thank you. So this question you have. I mean, the cost of education, we're taking it about the start of needs and comparing

with looking at it regarding value and trust. For me, it's far beyond convenience. The real thing is that the engineers are looking for value to get trust. I mean, when I need to start society, the costless that we're looking for now is more

you buy. My example would be when there was a cash restriction by CBN some time ago and there was a lot of queues at the ATM, banks went locked down, there was limited cash. Some technology came up at that time. I found a lot of information in the MCA. I would say many points will be there both like that. And then during the abroad thing was just transparency.

and the confirmation of a transaction. Many people were didn't get cash, but you could get it started a lot on the, on transaction. And that creates that growth, what the trust and value for the user or the beneficiaries to the extent too.

When you compare that to cashless education, there is something, education today now is not about the risks and water. It's about just a way in this space now. We want to be able to use technology very well to achieve the best of it.

People are looking for ability to listen clearly and attack this space. I had you said that, listeners can ask questions. We can interact with our new way we're talking from. I can also drop on any example in that regard to open up.

I'm not talking about my timing. When we had lockdown, I had a colleague of mine, a synagogue that said Zoom platform people would not be there with some combat kits

with this guy class. This is what business we do training. And I said, I'm enjoying this virtual session. And I'm enjoying it so much that it's so convenient.

And then people can join it at their own time. And it said no, and it couldn't plug into the period of time. It was waiting for the lockdown to be shot down. Till now, it could go above the physical session,

because it was so convenient. It's up to us as a company to reach out to students in UK, US and Canada elsewhere. I got a little access to speaking to a lot of people

Clubhouse. So when you look at the desktop space right here now, what we are looking for to a new book is the trust and value. And then that's what I can see that young engineers are really enjoying this space very well now. And I think that is what I can sell to inside of I would speak to what you expect. Thank you. There's trust and value is, those are key elements in terms of what the new

digital errors come to showcase and I'm sure that there are many people who are probably beneficiaries even as many countries struggle with grappling with the new realities. But I would like to ask Stanley, would you say cash less tech, how would you describe it?

payment, the cost of tools. And do you think that this is bringing back to our topic now? And do you think it's actually the first step in turning scores into many digital economies? Okay. How are you all here?

Yeah, but it's a bit faint. Yeah. How about an easy button, huh? Yes, much better. Okay. That's it.

So what's a good feeling everyone and thanks for this opportunity. So back to your question. First, I think it is more than just payments, right? So I will take it back to the foundations of how

rewiring happens, right? First, we learn habits, then habits becomes lifestyle, then it becomes a culture. If we are going to eventually build a sustainable data economy

or financial stability economy, we need to find a bit like embed payments into basic schooling. For example, I'll give you this beyond payment, right? This transforms schools into military economies in the sense that when And the introductions that have me ask the school itself

is able to regulate students spending. There is monitoring from the parents like the central dashboard where parents can monitor their kids.

Guardian is just like one of our moderators said, it was what her school Guardian said, that's a parent-believed transparencies is introduced. Now it doesn't just enhance the economy.

It's also enhanced trust. Now, this Lenas group trusting the ecosystem to help them skill, right? Then when you talk about convenience and security too,

it's also pleased, right? There's less I able to access almost anything they want without having to carry access load of cash. At the same time, you are not afraid of theft

or leaving your cash in your bag and you come back to class and it's gone, right? then introducing it early before it can evolve affect the entire economies. It first brings in this early Tracy, right?

Then the student themselves begin to realize how important it is to be the early treat, right? Then it goes back now, affect how this killed the other life.

Then it calls back to affect the entire economies as it's way. So I hope this also answers the question that was asked. Absolutely. Thank you so much for that. I agree with you about inviting financial solutions and if we hope to build a sustainable financial system.

So my next question would be to call our based on the things that Stani has shared. So he has spent some time talking to us about the benefits of what Scachete looks like. And I know for a fact that your 2018 bank has built one of such solutions for schools. So Paula, would you like to tell us a bit about that?

What's the name of the solution? And what made you realize at what point do you realize that who's needed the solution from the alternative back? Hi, Brooklyn.

Are you here? Yes, I'm here. Can we come with this? Do you want me to go by?

Please go back. Go by it again. Sorry about minutes. We'll talk about that.

I'll put you in the problem. So I was saying that talking about all the advantages or cashless tech that's in the shed because I know that the alternative bank has built such a solution, right?

So telling me asking you to tell us a bit about that and to just share a bit of the story what made the alternative bank realize that this is something that schools need? This is a change that is indeed now, right? All right, thank you very much.

That's such a beautiful question. So looking back at the example that is highlighted, it's one of the reasons, it's one of the things that inspired this product. Also, we are in the rapid changing society. Students, especially

as a pharmaceutical student, are developing amazing things recently and there's a need for financial inclusion, which is the number one 10 financial inclusion. Let's just to let us know that at a very early age you can learn about savings, you can learn about budgeting,

and also financial independence. The good thing about this product that we developed by the alternative grant is that while students learn about financial independence, they are still supervised by the appearance. So parents can monitor them, put them on the right track where they've noticed that the spending pattern is not sustainable. And also students are

conscious about their spending. Then at a very early age, they can make self-decisions to show that's imparted them and their way of the consequences. All right, thank you so much for coming. Do you, I didn't catch the name of the product of solution when you were speaking. Did you mention the name of the solution? The product is

pockets pal so it's an alarm is account that helps students to collect the alarmances from severe alarmances in an account where they're able to spend independently in the talk shop schools also are able to centrally collect all their receivables, bits, talk shop spendings or purchase from the school

from the school for sports experience, practicals and everything. So students are independently able to manage the spending through the use of these accounts and this customizable card. Alongside supervised control from the parents.

So this has encouraged face passes into financial literacy, financial exposure, and also encourages financial discipline from an early age. All right, thank you so much.

So in talking about adopting this tech, my next question will be to Mr. Patrick. Mr. Patrick, so I know that your, I believe your school has adopted cashless tech, right?

So when you want to use, I want to use the word when cash disappeared from your school as it were. What really changed?

What changed for the students and what changed for the school? the two questions between one. The second thing is for the parents as well, what was hanging about was it them hanging about control or did it build transparency between you and them

or did it expose some new needs to be handled? Did you get my question? Yes I do. Good evening everyone. Thank you for choosing for a line. She's like to come up. I want to appreciate an I'm going to have to make a good job. Thank you.

Okay, I wanna appreciate the opportunity to come in and look at it. We had issues. The school system of change, the children to also have change. We had issues when we started at school, and we had kids coming to school with cash.

And basically every day, or every year, someone stood my money, I didn't say my money or other thing. So at that point, we were thinking of what do we do? So when I approached an alternate bank,

I was introduced to Bocquets Bar. For us as a system, we're no longer here. My money has disappeared. That one has gone automatically gone.

Now for the children, the courage of using the ID card, which is also an ATM to cardiac transactions, build their safe path, abuse their moral, abuse their confidence that I can transact something

with my ID card, which is also an ATM card. I want to bring to us what happened when we went for a metric. We branch into a supermarket to get something And when we've already picked up all we have picked up

I understand to make payments. We walk up to the cashier and all of them brought our their cats and the cashier was looking at what is this nonsense? Are you trying to place much on us?

It's one of them told that no, this is our ATM card. Please can you please insert it into the POS. To our surprise, we did that, they put in their PIN and the fashion was successful.

So they just looked wild. So for us, it has brought in change to the system. It has brought in confidence in the children that they can carry out transactions.

And for the parents, it brought trust. Because why decrease we are carrying our transactions? The components we are getting the alerts from their transactions.

You are seeing it clear to us who are transparent. Now, in one of it, the one of the kids overspends, because I guess the limit for days 5000. So the child spends 5000.

And the plan just called immediately, why would she spend that 5000? So he brought it back to trying to teach our children the habits to save because it's not every money in your account

you need to have a spend. So you must lend the habits to save, which brings in the financial literacy. So for us, pocket parlors really changed so many things

in the school system to the parents and likewise, the children at large. Thank you. Thank you, sir.

I'll quickly give what's now to book all our quickly. And of course, to know Mr. Patrick was just shared a very interesting story about people going to ATMs And people being surprised by the fact that it's actually an ID card that is working

as the ATM card. My question is do you have any other, the other stories that are probably coming up in the first of our adoption that's probably made you think twice about every product spot for, or maybe even depending your assurance that this is the right thing to do?

Yes, thank you, Fissario. Yes, so we've asked several positive feedback and part of it is the case of reduction in the story of, I missed list my pocket money

or somebody stole my pocket money. And also the fact that even your ATM card for pocket bar can be customized to suit the school's preference

in terms of the logo, the color. Also, individual student picture is something fascinating. Most schools have been repositioned as forward thinking, as innovative. And as a change driver, just by adopting these products.

Also, we have parents giving feedback of the ability to control their child spending, So, appearances in Abuja, the child is schooling in Abuja. Without a phone call to say, Momi has spent this important example.

The parents are receiving our lives, and they know how their child is failing. They know what the child has bought. And then they can caution.

They can redirect the state of the child if they are going over the child in terms of spending. So, this supervised control is what we are really getting as a feedback from parents.

they are happy that they can help their children still on track with their spending and also lend to save the budgets and also to plan ahead. Then another factor, another thing that is really innovative about this product as well and that is hoping those decide, but we are going to really this kilo is the financial literacy and the exposure that comes with pocket power. Students

are no more being laid back. Personalized parents, I didn't even know what banking like. I had never been to a banking hall or even used an 18-car or a machine till I got into the university. Both the pocket power that's a changing. Okay, thank you very much, Bochola.

Just like what you've spoken extensively on the tech and the positive sides to the adoption, and I'm very curious because, you know, the more there's always an argument that the more tech savvy we get, the less empathy and the more interaction we would need and so on and so forth.

So my question now goes to Stanley. Do you think that what was the biggest design flow you've seen so far in education technology adoption? And second place of the question would

be how to get moved from just the step that we are right now in terms of the adoption and the acceptance of education technology and move to a true point where every school in a degree

becomes an adductor of technology, to cast technology otherwise. Okay, so first, I think the flow is a bit of balanced and simple, human design technologies and technology itself. I would say it's leaning towards one aspect or the other. I believe we cannot agree that sometimes we can overengineer if we

adopt and double down on the core feature, neglecting that there are all the segments of users. Sometimes you could generalize if you adopt to get that to a lot of users and you don't optimize some of most of the features of the money. So both elements of technology and human factors are both essential. And it says that technology provides

capability, assets and powerful tools for both personalised learning, while the human-in-party part-right ensures that technology such as good real-length which are emotions, context-on-its, I'll give you an example. There are three categories of Lenoxing every lending fees of life.

Primaries, secondary, treasury, everyone goes, graduates, we have the visual learners. We have the audio learners, and we have the kinesthetic learners. And for example, when most edu-text solutions,

when you look at them, it takes kids out a lot to visual learners. Sometimes, neglects audio learners. Or, yeah, or do people write.

And some students, it will learn by practicing those one, following the kinesthetic learners. So when we able to balance this bridge of creating educational technologies that balance and serve

these three categories of learners, then it's this very low view. Another topic example is for if a school running has special students or special kids,

and these kids, such students, would learn more by gamification. Right and gamification can be tied back to kinesthetic learning processes When you engineer such a product you want to make sure that they are in break in inside of us in sessions that are now

anybody's students to touch the speed in activities then also Too much tech without MP2 can make learning a few very

Inta sonar rigid on sometimes or most times discouraged right so as the same time also too much focus on the human factors without leveraging technology, can limits rich and innovation because technology empowers rich. A practical example is this year

from no real mainland in the United States, we have been able to train boats, compliance and sub-aggressions today and say Nigeria, Canada, UK and the right side because of technology. So if when balanced,

will use this cause can reach as many as possible students who probably think that teachers are slowing them down with the curriculum or weekly teaching in class and people ask a question or please can ask a question. Can go back to the uh uh the hostels pick up their gadgets open the assistance and

fire on a contingency of studies right as far as the squeeze regulates in it and there's a central dashboard to monitor activities. So the idea uh attack design is a thoughtful design that thoroughly integrates both advanced tech capability with deep understanding and of course responsiveness to

Lenas emotional and social realities. Like I said, like I gave the categories of Lenas earlier, then this now balance and creates both inclusive and supportable environment for these students. And this is how we can then skew massive adoption. If parents in

who can testify that technology is making their students their children better as grabbing or becoming better students or better learners. It's easier for us to use testimonials to impart in their schools, for example, when schools get good feedback, they post videos. People during these tech solutions both the financial and the edutecta part can then

play videos of other schools and new realities of order to dance in all performance and academic results on the measurement. They tell me that there are lots of people that are participating in test to that and show key points. It was before the deployment of technology. Points B was before the deployment of national technology to point C is

after the deployment of both the financial educational technology, imagine this to together city in party gives school in. Then it's easier to ask about across the different regions.

Again, if every joint different cultures and ship adoptions, it has paid the not only to easily just come into the text space and our dogs

with the early inclusion of financial technologies and even the educational technologies itself, because you have to first rewire them, re-enchant them and re-arrains it,

remind us then balance the tech impact. Same as some rural areas in the East, so call those two ship adoptions. And I believe what I would do balance this,

then we can then drive and kill adoption of goods, cashless additions and adoption of HPCN technology. Very well said, thank you so much. So you've talked about the things that can influence and aid the adoption of technology. But as we know, right, in every, let's just the word

revolution, when you're introducing a new thing new from a form to a tech solution like pocket how whatever it is you're introducing, there are always those people that will be left behind. So my question now is Mr. Brown.

In this context of introducing Kashita's tech, rather to schools, specifically secondary schools, who would you say would be left behind? So I know that it's very easy for instance,

study mentioned people in rural areas as against people in urban areas, and the difference in the speed of adoption. So would you say that there's a likelihood

that people in rural areas could be left behind or just people that are you know stalking and a lot of thinking who are the people that so there is you know those that are left behind left behind and those that are just like as like late adopters so yeah that's my question is the right hand

all right thank you very much okay we got weeks we got we left behind in many different ways we have a land of black over here So, in terms of... ...and...

...and... ...in... ...in... ...the...

...and... ...you'll be able to use technology. But when you look at schools, schools are able to adopt ...

...so technology, we've been really long done. I mean, the big spoke about the experience, the students in the school, uh, maybe to achieve...

...to learning. I mean, I've given it a connected line. our sites within school going to do for a future, be able to show people who don't understand things.

Things that are not a particular, not a curriculum. So, when we have a good size of looking at the lab left behind, where we have a lab game

because of lack of any environment, and schools too would be redundant. Because learning is going beyond the physical structure of learning.

There's so much things that the college got bringing beyond just telling me, Mr. Brown, you might still hear. I think we lost the nine of the day. I think we can just probably be able to continue to the next situation.

Why are we waiting for him to return? Okay, SS by. Okay. Okay.

So you are talking about schools in rural areas not being left behind because of the lack of infrastructure I believe that's where we get off. Okay I need to say lack of a structure for them. I said to areas we have a challenge.

Schools even within your bank and regular group that decide not to adopt such opportunity to the left behind because of a lot of structures, schools are required to be held behind. All right. Thank you so much, Mr. Brian. So I would ask quite a question from Mr. Stanley. Very quickly, if you could just in one minute tell us.

So some of the questions that I was bringing to you, what do you think are the least significant? So two questions we've got, if you can answer the question today,

we'll inform. So what do you think is the best thing that you can do and if you're supposed to do it? So what do you think is the best thing that you can do?

And what do you think is the most significant thing is that you can do it? Why financial institutions like your financial bank? But even by private stakeholders and the government

As a whole. Sorry, can you come again? I lost you for a minute. Not sure. Great. So I was saying that based of the problems that Mr. Brian mentioned, right, what do you think are the things that we can put in place?

Short term, both short term that can give us quick wins and long term, not just for financial institutions like the alternative bank, But also for private stakeholders or maybe even the government that can be, that can give us long-lasting solutions to some of the things that Mr.

Brian mentioned. That's my question. Okay, perfect. So let me start with Shatam. Earlier when Mr. Brian was speaking,

he made mention of the impact that pocket pal has made so far, right? and he gave some metrics and when I was talking earlier I talked about feedbacks and how it can ship narratives. Now for short time

I believe right now what needs to be built or shared is used to use the compute trust that's the first part because whenever you want to start an image like you said, as a move we left behind but at least if there is education to shape their mind then it is the other negligence that affected them. While a huge chunk of depopulation will also adopt

a for example AI eventually you will cite catching up rights so that's the very first of show So, these stories that the enable both financial institutions and it was audacity for that this cool themselves. It draws its parents to adopt these technologies with students to buy into these technologies

and it's like easier. Long term, I think it's frameworks, right? You can only then start to influence all ship policies that can upgrade frameworks for education One species tell to bring this inclusiveness into its operational

question that is where it is. The success stories are there. The impact is there. It's just not that we need free work.

The free work is now what's now impacts the long time. So education frameworks, financial frameworks, adoption of free work is over. Even compliance framework, very necessary.

The fact that these students are young, you live such power in their hands. experience and monitoring and other monitoring at the same time. So every tech, there is always going to be every human factor.

Right? So compliance is going to be very key. There are strict adherence. Then they cannot read back to what I said. They put it on some frameworks.

So I believe framework for long term, there's short term, I believe it's going to be. There's in views to least and be interested. Then everyone can now have the positive impact of few positive.

then there's less risk than there are small assets or funds for the students. As they're transparency for both the school and the parents and there is better for this anyone. The movements we do not sure about you on its own.

Yeah. Thank you, I will stand it. I'm actually very curious now to really know from book colour. What about you?

Do you mind telling us quickly? what do you think needs to happen for schools to be able to adopt this? How do you think that a lot more needs to be done or said from the standpoint of financial institutions that are probably building these technologies? Do you think that that's what administrative does need to probably eradicate themselves?

or how do you think that this gap can be bridged and how do you think that the financial institutions can actually help to bridge this gap. I'm just going to show that one sector is not so one part of the country is not carried along and being seen as four thinking and the others left behind.

Thank you. So I think Kimmejot then is awareness. So we need to raise more awareness on innovative products like this. Also, why our analysis has been raised, we need to ensure that platforms that are stable,

secured, efficient, and also user friendly, especially considering the age of the students are put in place. So digital payment solutions should be put in place,

and students should also be taught they should be introduced into out to use this various payment solutions. Also, very important is financial literacy.

We need to ensure that we carry everyone along from speak the language that the students understand. Ensure that they are exposed to financial shoes like savings, like budgeting, and also how sustainable

worlds can be built. I believe that if they're exposed to this at the very the early age we would be able to create a future where people are more aware of their financial decisions and generally this is going to impact the economy as well.

Also financial inclusion which is very important, it's the sense of all of this, ensuring that no one is left behind providing a platform that kind of promotes all and the language to understand. Also having financial literacy touch point which is very important. That's the summer key take. Okay thank you, Bekala. I would like to ask Mr Patrick is a question quickly.

Just ask to remind everybody to please remember to ask your questions via the chat. The chat room I will be feeding questions to the various because very soon. And just last question for Mr. Patrick before I take the questions from the house. Mr. Patrick, can you quickly just tell us, do you think that, and for two, for second

of those that are just joining the conversation, we've been talking about our cash education is transforming, and our cashless transactions are transforming education out life and nature, or generally basically. And we're looking particularly at secondary schools and the adoption of innovative tools

like pocket power to change the way they transact to build more trust between the students and their guardians and between parents and the true dream and so on and so forth. So Mr Patrick quickly, can you tell us, what do you say that we are currently in terms of the adoption of this technology for what you've seen based on your first-hand experience

in the school. Do you think for a reason a generation understands value or do you think we are just, you know, dwelling the fire of kids who just want to tap and spend without feeling the weight of money? Thank you. I guess we are reasonable generations that understand value. Like in one of the

tonight told you a child will overspend that the parents after calling immediately to caution. The child on his own partner knew that the parents will get the alerts.

So when the parents called, I just have to put it from the speaker and the child had the mom not meeting. Why did you spend more than what you were to spend?

Now the next time we went out again, I took note that discovered that the child didn't spend even half of that. what was given is it even no more to the user accounts.

So what it didn't spend much. So we are using generations of students who understand the value of money. What is done is not every,

there's my contact just have to spend. You know, kids will always be kids. They won't just buy anything, they can lay on.

But after that, they discover that they were able to order themselves in what they spend. They just buy what is needed.

They just also lose buy anything. So we are using generations of children of students who own value money, not just to your spellets. Thank you.

Thank you very much. There's been very, very comments. I am here today. You're cracking me up whenever you're convincing.

That's your per pocket power. I helped you call the bullying, all the money you spent on on Galandring. I'm sorry, you're having good works.

You know, let's go give up. I'm just going to try this open to the floor. Is there any demographic that can open a fit or disadvantage by these innovations? I think Stanley probably started to talk about that earlier.

I don't know if anybody else wants to speak briefly about this in about a minute or so. The question is actually open for any of these speakers who want to take it. Maybe I should direct the question to color. Did you say is there any demographic right now that you form your execution that you probably think are disadvantaged by these innovations?

No, so this innovation installation is open to all irrespective of your age. So So we pocketed from second risk school, especially of your age, you can get on board. Also as a alternative one, we have various solutions to get out for the need of young generations.

We have several products that help them to get introduced into financial independence and financial literacy at the very at the age. Also build their level of accountability. Well, for pocket power, we have this solution

for separate school students. You expect it will be a location. Your age, you can get on board ed and enjoy the benefits of pocket power.

OK, so while you had said I'm seeing a question from Creative Clan, is there an age bracket for this type of accounts? Does it apply to all ages?

levels of education. So pocket pallets are part of the lives of students from 10 to 17 years where we believe you should be in the second risk school and so far you have second risk school you can use pocket pal. On budget is via your school, you

school this with press interest and we onboard the school and then the students because we're preaching on this ticket education so we want to walk with the school to ensure that's where able to impact the students.

Okay. I would like to just quickly go around the room now. I don't think I see any other questions. I don't know if it's going to be.

Yeah, I think that's that's that's all the questions I see right now. If there are other questions or if there are additional questions. Well, this because are given their final thoughts. Please feel free to share or raise your hand and I'll call upon you to to ask a question and answer the room.

I just start with Mr. Brian. We'll find out for it. Well, my final thoughts would be, my question was, I wanted to ask the question regarding the age,

because I understand the mindset regarding technology for parents. We have been, some parents have limited kind of restriction terms of screen time for children, and then they build that as a limited to technology

at this time, we too much for kids. By the time you put everything on the mobile, that have, or whatever it is, there'll be some access to restriction.

I mean, there's a way, there's some of those happenings and sites that have got kids there to be isolated. And you know, what we became of from, there's always, there's what we related,

are framed by attending neighborhood house. But when you have everything closing into this thing, you find that kids become isolated. And these get the mindset of adoption of technology.

So that's why going back to someone, one of the best states, we need to promote the good story of it. We need to promote the benefit of this. We need to promote what it can be because it's a next workforce.

But the traditional way of thinking kind of limits the adoption. There was like that. My story to my thoughts with Google to alternative bank about the pocket power that we need to promote the benefit of it so much that, I mean, if you have technology, I can only be touched on using technology. So definitely the best of the ready should be the best of us.

And that would be my final talk. Thank you very much. Thank you sir. I'll actually hear now from, I don't know if,

I don't see Stanley anymore the call. So I think I'll just go to, oh, he's starting to hear.

I don't think I see him. Okay, so I think Mr. Patrick, you can probably just show you, show you the last.

I want to use this medium to appreciate an alternative bank, at least for Commonwealth East idea. I didn't think the bank would come to a rescue when we had issues about kids missing

out their money and still doing another thing. I want to suggest that it's high time the bank collaborate with schools because this is meant for schools, not just the public and the public and the public is meant for schools. So, if you walk in and in the way schools, they should go to schools, share the ideas with

them. Yeah, we're enjoying it. And like what I told a friend of mine, I said, if you're not, if your kids are not using pocket power,

it means you're not in the 24th century of carrying out cashless policy. So when I had, when I saw this, I shared my own undoes without our friends,

which I guess we're not too long listening. So obviously that is item, the bank pattern that would cause. And I think if we do that, all go a long way.

Thank you so much. Hello. Can you hear me, please? Thank you very much, Mr. Patrick, for the third year.

All right, so now we're putting a book on our last thoughts on the conversation. Thank you so much, Mr. Patrick. Thank you, I am indeed.

Mr. Patrick has one of the people, one of the school administrators that is currently in joint pockets, but I said a lot. Yes, spoken about the benefit for the school

for the student and also for parents. Pocket power cannot be, it's something that should be adopted by all the schools. Because it ensures oversight functions is a source

that the cases of lots of market pockets money, tech is eliminated completely. Also, the schools are sent as forward-thinking schools. So it's something relatively new

And you'll need to be a healthy high doctor as a school owner. So you need to enjoy the pocket pal with, with ensure that your students also benefit from it. So that even when they graduate from your school,

they are living with a high level financial literacy. So let's spread the word about pocket pal to school owners and ensure that the common board, that their students can enjoy pocket pal,

they can enjoy pocket pal, and even prevent enjoy peace of mind. Thank you. Thank you so much, Vocala.

Can't believe I was speaking muted. Sorry about that. I was asking just to confirm if Stanley has given us his last thoughts.

My network was funky perfect. Not yet. I think I lost my little area. Can you guys hear me now?

Loud and clear. OK. Thank you. So yeah, my last thoughts were just

to re-acuse the part of Pocket Pal has created and amazing solution, right? And I would like to just refresh our minds on Nesus success in Japan, right?

The long-term goal of educating minds because again, the young ones are the walking class of tomorrow, they become the appearance of tomorrow,

they drive adoption. But while that is the long-term goal, at the same time, what I said earlier, pushing the success to be driving trust,

then shippingfirmworks.com. and it was this adoption apart from school and adopted tech preventionist also by into the idea and into the technology and the students need to believe and trust it to help them out. So yeah, I think that's still my narrative. Thank you.

Thank you. I'd like to say a huge thank you to all our speakers. You all added flavour and of course your wealth of knowledge and experience this conversation. So thank you so very much. Thank you so much to all those that joined.

We'd like to close with by reading a comment from Darry from the comment section because I feel these comments completely, you know, summarizes everything we've been talking about.

Darry says the shift to cashless cashless debt by schools is a sign of progress. No cash, no payers, just convenience. Cashless debt is quietly transforming school life

for the better. Most of this would promote the use of technology among views and help them save more. I could not agree more, Dari.

And I just note, we'd like to say thank you again for joining. For those who may not be aware, this X-space was brought to you by the alternative bank.

If you would like to know more about us, our DM is very open, and our website is also there, www.authentitybank.org,

about www.allbank.eng. So you can check what's out there, you can chat with us if you have questions and queries or concerns, even about adopting pocket pal that we just discussed on this X-based thank you and have a beautiful, beautiful,

beautiful evening. Thank you so much for joining.

Episode 07
Nation building

The Nigeria Question

A big-picture conversation on what progress can look like when people, businesses, and communities move together.

01:30:49 Nation building Open on X
Open full transcript

Hi, Miss Ayur, good evening. Hi, Amy. Yes, I can. Good evening, everybody.

And welcome to this conversation. My name is Olafisayashid and they are Bior moderator for today. I think just like to take the opportunity

to thank everybody for joining in. Just a few housekeeping rules, which I'll still repeat this later on. but you know, while the conversation is open for everybody,

to participate in the conversation with particularly B amongst a few e-speakers, more afterwards, we would be opening the floor to everybody to contribute in any way that you,

or to any other part of the conversation at the time. If you're interested in speaking, please feel free to, but just raise your hand and I'll give you the speaking rights after which you can share

a point ask your questions or contribute to the discourse and the commission will start properly by 6 p.m. Thank you. Good to know you. Good to have you again.

Thanks for staying on and thank you to our speakers for making the time to be here. On the convention earlier, my name is Fissai, and I'll be, my job is pretty simple today. It's just to stay at the conversation and let the rest of you do most of the talking, in terms of just sharing your ideas about the topic and what would you take Nigeria to work?

I would like to also wish everybody happy independence. They have guests and most of us on the call are Nigerians, and if you're not, Thank you also for celebrating and joining the conversation just in terms of, you know, helping to shape the future of our great country. It's pretty exciting time to be an

major and it's also a pretty challenging time to be an Nigerian. And as we all know, today's majority 65th anniversary or 65th independence anniversary of particularly, And today all around us, we've seen a reflection of our journey. We've seen various assessments of our current stand in the federal government,

so they published four page, our tutorials on how far the country has come. Therefore, that I've been putting place just to ensure that we are on the right track. You know, I'm just deliberately trying to shape the future of the country. And the question before I said the confirmation earlier is what would it take for Nigeria to truly work?

And in the spirit of unity and progress, I like us to engage in constructive dialogue and technology, the fact that our knowledge challenges celebrate our resilience and also shape the future for what one needs to come next for us to actually move forward as a people. Before I continue, I'd like to introduce our speakers who are currently on the call or on this session.

First, I would like to start with Ugo Moa. Sorry, Lydia Ode. Am I getting that correctly? Sorry, apologies.

I would like to introduce first. a tire consider you are currently not a speaker or like someone am I seem to please have addressed this so that the entire will be able to speak. So a tire is the founder of

Yitiva. If someone are followed closely for a while now, Yitiva has done a lot of great things with the Oitiva. I love great intuitive, I just in terms of providing opportunities for young people to learn, for them to get hired, for them to get spotlighted with the

and get an opportunity to become real contributors to the local international economy. As the city of YTIRAS led the company to train over 100,000 individuals and tech skills and support supporting the organizations in the UK, US and Nigeria to obscure and to recruit

top talents. Most people here know him as, or some people here will name us, we take advantage of this because he has a good reputation for driving the impact through innovation. If you've read some of the stories that Italy has shared, you've been marveled as to how he has come this far. I know he puts that something, maybe

sometimes last year about what it did with regards to the culture and how difficult it was and how we fought the head and just embodied the true Nigeria and spirits. These workers who are in the numerous recognitions include them being named the Facebook Community of the Antwins 2020 at Lions of Pernier. I recon incubates our fellow

My chef in scholar is also an atlas cop fellow and a global good phone fellow as well so I like to Obviously introduce a tie to the public and I type you could just Say hello to everybody

Hey, hello everyone good It's after nearly a good afternoon everybody really pleasure to be with you I really hope that my background is not noisy because I'm walking from a cafe and I hope everybody can hear me well. Nice to meet you and thank you for that.

Yeah, we can hear you. We can hear you. Thank you and thanks again for making the time and I'm hope to work for a great conversation. Next, I'll be introducing for Thai Thai So, I'm just in session, so I'm happy to be here. Okay.

So I would, thanks for, thanks for the introduction, that I saw before. Before I left the tag, God, I just like to quickly say a few things about him. For a tie is an accomplished banker with a fortune of five years of experience.

is worked in numerous institutions including Stelling Bank at Kobank. It's now currently serving as the chief of Britain of the South York Institute Bank. And his expertise spans strategically the ship project management,

which has improvement, the tonality, links and so on and so forth. He's, he likes to say that he's guided by the principles of passion, innovation integrity and excellence and all these things are,

what it causes, piety and which I'm sure that In a way, that ties back towards what we want to talk about today in terms of what we would actually need to drive Nigeria forward. Qatar has a BSC in

computing and construction management from the University of Lagos, so that way he had his MBC and ZMSC. He also has various degrees and certifications from institutions like NCA. I does INSED Cambridge Columbia Oxford LBS where he is on the skills of the time in the data transformation

and business analytics and leadership. So once again thank you for making the time to be here sir and we look forward to a productive conversation. Next up I would be introducing

Pregio. Pregio Iguu-Que is Pregio the Que is currently the service She currently serves as the CEO of... She currently serves as the CEO of St.

Anyone Foundation. She's also a board member of the UN Global Compact Manager and I told my director that she does. UN GCSO, if you don't know, that organization is actually

the one that houses many profits, institutions who are doing amazing and great work just in terms of making an impact in the country. And the pedrie is a strategist with nearly 20 years experiencing corporate and social impact leadership.

Using our platform, she's driven and multi sector partnerships in education, health, climate, action, gender equality and youth empowerment. She also combines the Africa social impact

so it does popularly not too many here as ACES. She also leads giving that energy, which is Africa's first free crowdfunding platform. as you co-creativity, as you free a multi-partner,

like PWC and Unido. She has also been recognized amongst the venture's Africa Stop-22 Man of Impact. And she's also received, and she has a report

that she's been about the orders were for expertise and governments and governments, communication and social media development. Gageul takes pride in abilities

after these strengthening systems and friends policy and accelerate them as it's across the country. All of our work is actually geared towards ensuring

that Africa and Africans are actually moving forward in terms of development. And we thank you for your work, we're happy to have you as well

at the conversation today. Thank you very much, Elizabeth. I'm good afternoon, everyone. It's my pleasure to be here.

Okay. Lastly, it's our introduce, likes to introduce Lydia O'Day, with a development leader,

civic and engagement specialist. She is a development leader. And she also has to see what went to the end of experience in driving reforms in government,

transparency, accountability, and social inclusion in Nigeria. The lead here who is a log up by training is also part of the personal advocate

for the self-communities. She's also a legal advocate in the shared lives in capacity building policy advocacy his beauty and structure in industry, in governance.

Just generally, she's just results oriented and she's driven by the ability to actually talk and do so essentially the money time and value it. She's successfully managed more to put an off on their platforms and she's currently serving as the Chief of Party or CEO of Kapastika, Talis, Kazar Singh, also known as

she's not for clarity in the science and inspiring presence. So this conversation is going to be breaking and taking a little expertise and coming back to just general conversation and getting a voice to issues around gender equity, civic innovation, sustainability development, and so on. So I don't think she's on the call yet and I'm sure when she joins you will be able to

to be able to say hello. So again, thanks everybody for making the time to be here. And I'll just try to set the tone for to this conversation. So Nigeria, as we know, stands at a very important job

to just not just in terms of the fact that we are. celebrate in 65 years of independence since 1960, we've also faced as much as we said, it brings to have also been battling

the same issue that demand agenda attention. This issue is range from economic diversification to regional development, security concerns, infrastructure, deficit, and so on and so forth.

Now, there is a need for us to take a comprehensive approach to nation-building and the time for that has never been more important than now. Just even just giving the recent incentives

that have been up on around us in the last few weeks days. So they would try to dive into some of these areas and just explore the initiatives,

the role of the private sector, the contribution to the civil society to helping shape a prosperous Nigeria. Now as we go into this topic,

I'd like to encourage our panelists to go share their insights and experiences out of those in weather audience to participate actively post questions,

share your perspectives and less collectively explore. So, Rishan, Sushalanges that we face, lastly, as the first question, I was actually meant to remember,

and I remember my grandmother, that is the dialogue, not the monologue, and I was spoken a lot, but everybody's voice matters

in shipping the future of Nigeria, and that's an important gift. And so the first question I would like to ask is which regards economic,

just in terms of the general consumer, economic growth, which is probably one of the most pressing things right now. Now, President Obama to the good administration

has actually set ambitious goals, including achieving 7% or GDP growth by 27% and the plans also quadruple the economy by 2030. While it doesn't look like it now in terms of progress,

we're sensing that we've actually shown promise with 1.2%, GDP growth, that's Q2 of 2025, which is the fastest in four years. And we've also witnessed an easing inflation,

which is now up to about 20.12% that August 2025. And this stands as the lowest in three years. However, despite this, there are still issues. And with over 1.29 million,

I was going to leave in below the poverty line. And what do we, how do we ensure that economic growth translates to tangible improvements for the lives of Northern Ireland? And I like to start the conversation with Pidju.

So how do we think that this economic growth actually can translate to improvements in the lives of Northern Ireland? Hi, Pidju. Hi, there.

Okay. So if Pidju is unable to speak right now, Tatai, Tala, would you like to see if to take this up. Okay.

Hi, Annie. Hi, Annie. Hi. Hello, Annie.

Yes, we can. Yes, we can. We can. We can't.

I know, Annie. Sorry. I'm a big, big, big, big, big. Okay.

So I, I, I understand you're just, good. And I understand the goal that President is doing. I'll help, I'm, I'm,

I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm just like, to look, people would see that to it. I think it was a tremendous amount of snow that in Netflix, I mean I think we don't mention it now, it's a said bar. I must say that it

let it shoot from now. I mean the tracks are from, I will let it be used to tonight, the busy things that I think today is really much food and it has to go through education and I turn everybody and enjoy everybody will become a good video for us to talk. I think we as well as the city of LA for them as usual through today.

We need to take our renovation and back. So I think as it's not exactly what it is, I think it's a little bit of a situation, I'm not just doing it on this. It is a little bit more sad. It's a little bit sad. And then it's not a little bit

sad, but it just translates to, you know, all the translates are a little bit of yes. So I'm saying is that wow, but fair, we're going to focus on the nonsense. It's just for what we want to rise in mind and see. That is one

path. Then the second task again is that the problem is almost the entire zone. One of the major challenges that you have in this country right now is that the best and then I'll say to government,

if you check on the website, I think that's what the best way down inside of government. If that is why they're gonna kind of be bigger, because they're gonna be the best way,

they'll give you the best, the energy advice, all the best economic kind of advice. But just what you have,

you just all the way, you have more sense on anything that's happening against anybody. But we don't have the best way now,

so we're getting into it. So if you have less updates, so let's say, let's get people from the internet

and try to get their friends out of your country. So there's gonna be a business now, So there has to be in calculating of the balance. Now what we have in this country is so they try to be very cool with that. And I'm saying that India says that we have the

tax on gains, the gains of this will remain in the government. There will be less rates. Changes. If you do want to get any sexualized done on the own, we follow the tenants and the owners country, we didn't include independent technology, we look at the other side, the tenants and the tenants and the tenants,

the entertainment industry outside of the country. Do you think these guys are not in including Roslyn and we removed all the expectation and the diagram. We're gonna do a lot of things.

I think I was there before the speakers to do that. I think that's actually a bit of a solution. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. So, it's a lot of going to pick up from here.

Just giving your experience with a lot of young people who are probably a lot of whom are probably in the self-communities. What are your observed to be the key thing that is probably caused the disparity in why

what is seeming to be economy growth is only on one side and is not actually improving the lives of people in, you know, the mass nitrogen, probably if I may say that. Yeah, thank you so much. I just hope that my background is not noisy.

Am I very horrible? Yes, we can. Thank you. Thank you.

I think that we've achieved a few of these as a country in the past three years. I don't want to start to over-end for size, the things that we've achieved.

Few subs to do remote or big achieved mains, that are some sort of like translated to almost 15 trillion on Naira just last year in terms of revenue on a federation account that's more money. We have achieved

a production market unit in the meantime today there's nothing that gives me more joy than just realizing that if I wake up within the morning my dollars is almost going to be have the same rates with the data walks in the bank. It's hard. Alpha, we've come, but at least this unification gives me a bit of confidence. My investors that come in know what they're coming in

with and they know what they're getting out with. Someone like me that raised a little money from international investors, that gives them confidence now. If I bring in my $100,000 into Nigeria, I'm certainly going to leave with my claim on it and then exchange rates. The transition was painful, but today when I talk to investors, especially the investors

and the global North, it's exciting to have that level of confidence. Non-whiler of a new globalization, I think we're doing better. I think I was reading a report just some few days ago. between January to August, almost 20 to 20 on the year.

You know what? But all this money, what is happening? Why is it not transmitting to real impacts the common engineering man?

I would speak as a typical Nigerian. And I'm not going to speak as a false league idea. The first problem is the fact that the engineering is living on the stage, what is happening in the country.

It's typical, and that region in the engineering does not understand this country. all the gaming understandings is and it's a blend president for what is going on. It's almost impossible. I hear you when you say that the best of all that

not in government but I disagree. I chilton in disagree. I just want to agree with the best of all that not in government. I think that if we have a country of almost 200 million people and we have more resource and more morning buoyancy of the local government And we clean that the best of both are not in government.

Do we have, why can't we have that best of all? All the local government that countable for the outcome and the play in the parts of the resources that are unallocated to that.

That is like the fundamental problem that I see. Like talk to you as a young guy that is that in the ages, the local governments, oh well, I mean, I'm very grassroots.

Forget about all the English and speaking, I'm very, very grassroots. on a local chief in IDG. You know, if I walk the same blocks,

my talk to your own chap, can ask, I can fatter go recon, tell me that young people don't even know the name of the app, no program when channel.

You don't know where the names of the house of assembly, you don't remember. If you don't know how much is getting into the local government,

you know, how much the local government will see the navigation. When you don't have this from the mentor knowledge, how did you hold the local government accountable? And it's impossible for me to call the type of event

to counterable. You can strike as much as you want. You can do all the things that I would care about, call the president named Real Impacts

that's from the local database. And that's like the first link that I see here. I see a bunch of like two playing and say the James people and the private sector

were doing well. But one of the people who don't just understand how to translate that knowledge to an agent local government aims. We don't even know where the real value sits. That for me is like the

basic and the fundamentals of problem. You know, yeah. We all, everyone comes out in a lecture and we all make noise and screen and talk about APC and PDP and Labour Party. Forgetting the fact that your local government, the amount to date, will receive to the first of October we can receive another billion of

Naira in easel art out. Why are we not all the indoors people accountable? You can't all them accountable because you also don't understand the way golf nans walk and they'll go go mainstream. Your aims that discrepancy. Now if I shift slightly away from them, you know, I kind of like think that we are

other who leads to the plan, right, as a country in terms of it. This is how we wanna move. But we are not translating that plan into real actions

that we need to take as a much more grassroots level. Let me give you a few examples. And one is we don't have a data that helps us to understand how many SMEs in the country

made access to credits, providing the credit to our school and SMEs, not just the banks. The banks have the data of those that hold accounts with them. What are often they do those transactions?

The bank team. But we need to create very direct policies and programmatic implemented impacts. Actions that we then implement to provide, you know, finance and

a conversation cost, for example, at scale. You know, we need to, I know we are doing a bit of work in new CNG, boss fleet and all these things. But how do we call it transportation costs? Especially for people that are moving groups.

And especially for those that are moving on the main groups. Right? That is like the little things that we can do at a much more state level, you know, local government level that would have direct impact. But I am more excited about education and, you know,

job creation. Sometimes I don't talk about education and job creation. It sounds like half-edge. Well, it looks like the country is doing some things

that just of recent, there's a T-VET program that provides about 5,000 an hour to an average young person to learn a skill. But that sounds like very good.

And I love it. We need to also mobilize more young people to be on the stand or the suboxi. So for me in summary, it will be that we are disengaged

at a local government level. We want to build a country where the government babysit us, especially when it comes to really view as of each right on the standard

what is going on at your local government level. And then developing a clear model and how you want to engage at the local government level. We need to make the federal government less attractive.

You know, we need to make politics at a federal level very, you know, not to attract even make governance and politics at the local government attracted. We need to like, apply to our local government and gauge names and activities project and that level and educate young people so that we can mobilize and engage at a certain

level because that is the real state of things. That is where change actually happens. Okay. Thank you, you, Tyra.

So, for Tyra, as I'm giving context, sort of the fact that there needs to be more accountability, self-consubility by the people who are old and the, the, um, mantle in government, they Tyra has spoken about the fact that people need to be more, um, accountable So the people that's the elected as leaders at the state and local level.

And I'm going to move now to create your quickly just to because I know it becomes a different perspective from a development perspective. But what would you say as costs the reforms at the federal level and all the things that we've said, you know, it has mentioned a few things.

the next, why is it? I'm saving billions of NARA from first-up city, claiming GDP, I'm sorry, that inflation is now reduced. But I bet that if I walk into a Laquer market,

now the same heat that the trade has a feeling remains. So what's causing this lack of what's causing this developmental progress not to trickle down to the bottom of the pyramid, if I may.

Thank you very much, Fisaya and I must really commend FT and A-Tires comments on this question. I will look at it from a bit much more high level perspective and my submission will to be a lack of clarity of a common vision for us as a people. What exactly does success look like if these reforms work?

I do not, if I ask people on those call now, I doubt I would have the same response from a minimum of two people. There is no vision at different levels. For the common man we expect you to have food to eat and I think, as I mentioned, that

people are hungry, yes, food to eat, there should be access to basic services. Is that what success looks like? Because if there's no, there's lack of clarity on where exactly we are headed. Everyone will be trying to get to a certain destination in their minds.

So when we say it is strictly down, what does strictly down mean exactly? Where is it clearly spelled out? Where that does not exist, you really cannot blame people for trying to do what they think is right or trying to deliver on a certain goal in their minds.

That may not be common to all. We hear of a dream. What exactly is the Nigerian dream? We're 65 today.

What is the Nigerian dream? What do we all desire for Nigeria? That is common to all of us. I doubt if there's any, and I think I would ask you if you say, do you know of any?

So, Jan has no, I think I'm worried just once to be successful in some kind of way, but that's that difference from four, five, everybody. So when it comes to governance, I think we should have another star on what we intend to deliver to the Nigerian people.

It's clear to the government, the leadership and is also clear to the people. Then we have some certain metrics and KPIs. For those that work within the private sector is driven by key performance indicators. So you know what is expected of you at the end of a given period.

So it is not all up in the air. And when some people have food to eat, I assure you that even if today, most Nigerians have foot to it and they have ploughton their bags and they have shelter and they have access to education, we can still have

this conversation because these are some people's standards, we are still nowhere we need to be. There needs to be first a definition of what success is. It is practice in the private sector, it is even practiced in some cases for in the development

sector when donors give you funds. You have clarity on what the expectations are, as a country what are the expectations of success. That I think is the foundation.

That is a bit, I would say is destroyed is on clear. So what exactly do you expect of those who are responsible of selling the ship of those country to a destination that destination is my defined. I think that is the crux of the matter. When there is a clear definition of what expectations are

of different stakeholders from the local government level to the state government level to the federal government level, what are the expectations of these different reforms. What are we expecting? One day is a a semblance of commonality. I say a semblance of commonality because we're

such a diverse set of people. We really do not expect everyone to be thinking the same way that's impossible. But when the 70% or even a 60% of of Nigerian have this certain expectation that this is what our non-star is like.

Then we can start looking at how far have we gone in comparison to the non-star? I think we should apply what the total in school, empirical analysis, data-driven assessment,

then we can say, oh, this is where we are, in comparison to where we are supposed to be, I start with vision. I'll stop here if you say thank you.

Thank you very much, Gradu. And this is, this is shaping up to be very a chess in conversation because I just like commenting in the chat section, which, which I hope

that Lydia will be able to answer. I might just provide some clarity to. For that, you're my system. You're making them, you're taking on to say something.

Because I've been trying to, I mean, yes, I can. Okay, yeah, I think it's an interesting and interesting thing, it's a great dream.

I think I just touched here and there, I think it decided to, expectation is the beginning of the day. So I will use election practices,

every election cycle, but the system forums are the relaps what the insights you do, which one is the base list,

and what we measure them on, what we call a goal, and instead of, I will literally declare that

we'll get this question today. is not about this segment moment, because there's no same, this is getting kind of loose. I guess 60, 60, 60 years ago,

you know, it's not getting very extra. So it's not about this segment. It's about the entity called Nigeria. So first I'd like to respond to a retiree

that's already decided with me. And I like to, I like to be kind of thinking that it shouldn't be disagreeing, that the budget that goes mainly.

I think I'm all going to know that In the early days of Nigeria, that's a great way to address. And that's great that you're the government. And we government can tell you that treatment,

I mean, you have citizen members singing the video, unless you're in the city, city, city, and energy. And we have this kind of literature, and then the secretary is doing a great thing.

I get one potential and respect everybody. The key to Nigeria and the representatives. So you see, well, you have the best way in the government. I'm still saying, if you have a title for example, in government, you cannot

compare what is going to actually, which somebody who is there, or just a group of there, you understand the fiction, is that tuned with the youth, because the chief of the game is what the youth wants. It has a group of understanding of what's going to describe in that. So, this vision is very strongly, both are the differences on the politician, who is

and there and we will be able to do what we will do is we will make a new place on the ground and make money. It's not a bit different. If you put all the tech all you see, because the question about it is that it's a little different, it's a little bit different, it's a kind of change of business.

What that kind of is a journey. The country, the country, the country, the country, the country, the country, the country, the country, the country. So today, if all the people that we are inside the world make this and then attract you and get you started going in.

Everybody that was attending with countries. But it's still outside and the data's trying to fix it. The only way problem, but these are for the data,

even the people that are still in the community. Our data is going to be exactly what we're doing. They're not even having to know that. The question about that,

are we going to be responding to the way it is? It's something that we've been. I think the South Korea is going to be in the, we're going to be in the South Korea,

but we're going to do that, but we're going to do that. And we're going to get this. I think it's become. Yeah, I think the first thing it is going to be.

Well, the new that is content. That's the way it is. I think it was like that's it means that we test that from there. Again, you know, you know, you understand what my thousand

students are getting. So the other side. So they show me what I think we have to start from the nine to the first. The basic things for any man, they need to do to the attention.

For things, another way, I think that's the other thing. I think that's the fun. and the citizens and the United States and the awards, those to be things like women.

Like many communities, and need to cry in a country where we want to see the basic things of life. Nothing has to start. When that one starts,

I must have to do the slack paper because submitting the economy in the city to connect with basic three things. I think that that's a government used to work

really based when I do that as an engineer who goes to the world program, focusing with the net framework, also in the world program.

It was when we found it in the family's family manufacturing things that we're not supposed to do. On the side, we're in the wrong direction. Start to think maybe and where we're not supposed to be. And I'm very much the day.

This country considered it. It was the very kind of a mission. Every understanding and go back to the places. The business that we're trying to do not be.

That's a very fantastic place. Because we don't know the place, we don't know the place. We've got to be a few people who can't see time. What is that?

Because if you find this time, what's wrong with this? I think it's just that there's no problem. I think it will be a good deal. Thank you.

Thank you. I would like to, I mean, so some of the things I've been established now, because at the end of the day, the goal of the session is for us to be able to answer the question as to what is going to take to work. So we understand that there's no one size fits all solution, but it's just really how do we take

like struct the elements of this conversation and then start to apply them so that we can actually make progress as a country, as a nation. I'd like to pivot quickly just in terms of just sort of kind of take a look at that's a bit of in terms of just the bit, look a little deeper into the utilization of funds before I speak about infrastructure.

There is a concern generally about some funds have been utilized, a location of, for example, not central development, a commission of the K-1140 billion for 2025 to simulate economic activity within the region. But where these, because there's a I think there's a lot of information about the effect of the expansion of this forms, which reports

indicating that this income portion is spent on personal costs, whether or not development projects. And I like to, you know, I believe you have to speak to this. Maybe I think we can ensure that this commission, that's at my local level, a much of a full-food yeah mandate and delivering the opposite of the government. It's how you're already touched on an aspect of this earlier

that we spoke about the fact that we as a people need to hold the government at a local level accountable. So what's your perspective on this? Thank you, Fisio. This this same has been really interesting conversation as everybody has.

And I completely agree. But you know, before we can hold, I was hoping to talk about something, when we think about what would take to work, I was hoping, and I'll probably talk about that eventually,

something that is really close to my heart, that I'm very concerned about. But I think, I believe that for us to hold the local governance accountable,

we need to strengthen it, and that's where the crux of the matter is. Even right now, we have seen our local governments, we still have local governments that are

disturbing our penalties of the state government. And that means that the state government continues to manage this funds. And if they do not have that kind of capacity, if they do not have that kind of autonomy,

then it's really difficult to hold them accountable. I remember a few years ago when we were trying to do some work to strengthen local governance and some of the pushback that we get is that we can't really see anything without the state. So that what we need to do is to start from the governor and then the governor will give them the impetus and then the authority to

to respond to us basically or to carry out some of the reforms that were requesting that was critical to improve governance at the local level. So I think the first thing is to really strengthen that if we want the local government, if we want the local level

governance to be accountable, then they really need to be strong. They really need to have that autonomy. So when we're thinking about reforms,

I know that the constitution already provides for that the Supreme Court, that it has already said that they do have autonomy. but in practice they don't have that autonomy.

So how do we begin to think about reforms that is able to actually in actual terms give them that autonomy? And that really brings me to my concern,

which is what I think is that we're really grappling with is politics. I mean, we have become so divided and it's something that really concerns me.

have been so divided in this country that everybody views every single action through the prism of that division. So if anything is going on, if any appointment is made, if any reform is carried out, instead of people reviewing their reforms and see how they can leverage it to bring about good governance or bring about better.

How they can better lives for Nigerians. We're really thinking about does it benefit my region? If it's a commission that if the law has established a commission, who is the head of that commission?

Why is there in Niger Delta commission? Why is there none in the north east? Regardless of the reason why those commissions are in place. So we are constantly looking at things

through that prism of division. So if you were also to ask me what it would take to make Nigeria work without beyond the aspect of strengthening local governance

so that it can really be accounted and people can hold them accountable. It's also building that cohesion. That sense of unity that we used to have in the past.

And that's why I said that politics seem to be one of our biggest problems we need to think about reforms that makes policies, well, one less incentivizes politics less

or incentivizes as the case may be. Because if you think about the division that we are seeing in the country that has become so pervasive, you find out that there's politicians that are driving it.

And they are driving it because they want to get rid power or the wants to stay power or keep power. So how do we come together to think about reforms that will make politics less attractive and then that will make people more accountable to the people and then there are some kind of repackage for politicians that are not accountable

to citizens. So just in a nutshell I would say that we need to strengthen the institution at the local level and when that is strengthening then we can definitely talk about holding them accountable. With the way that it is now it is really difficult to hold them accountable when they don't even have the postrooms and whether they seem to have the postrooms, it's just

like we say informally it's just more like audio that somebody else that is really is really driving what happens with that money or with the resources that they have available to them. Over. Can you hear me? Have I been speaking to myself all this time? I heard you very well, Lydia.

Oh, okay. And I think, um, Fisio, I think Fisio has a, a slack network issue. So maybe I would ask one more question of you leading. Sorry, can I go? Okay.

Can I go back? Was I your e-time? Of course, me. I was trying to, I was trying to answer.

Please go ahead. No, she said. Okay. I think I tell you what's it is.

I have a very open, I think, think how citizens cannot hold the leaders accountable for what they don't know. You know, budget contracts, but it must be open and accessible. So in terms of what we are talking about is local government. I always have these ideas.

I always joke with my friend, that they, they, you know, everything about the engineer of your car. Well, by because they, you know, the, or, you know, I mean the kind of functioning. Well, because the kind of functioning, well, or you need to start your car, whatever you want to be, is on the dashboard.

The next time, no one in a hour will say, time shots, I'll just say, but I should be able to say, I was saying, that many kibis going.

If everything is working well, if everything is working as a supposed to be, I don't need to know really look at the nature of my list.

I don't need to know anybody's. Because when things have become structured, I don't know what to do. I'll start asking, who is that?

For example, today, if there is no security, the problem in the late last year. It would be a deep view of the conventional police. This way somebody robbed us, somebody was

robbing our police. And I think one thing to work well, we don't have to take a lot of police on the radio and make trouble to get a job at that point there

and make a job at that point there. So, we are both about the equivalent of the people in the community. I can't hear my only one. Sorry.

I'm sorry. But I thought that the application was zero to none. So today, it's even said to me that my question is, so many people have a responsibility.

So far, he's not going to be. So far, he's not going to be. Well, he can't hear the office. I think it's better now.

What I got from what Fatai said is when things are working well, there's no need for people to be knowing or seeking out those responsible. If you guess that's seeking out someone, it means that the person is not doing their job well. Fatai, am I correct? Exactly.

But you're very... I'm quickly saying something. Okay, I think so on. It's always talking.

Now, I was going to say that when the idea that when things are working where you don't need to seek out who is in charge, it's sort of defeats the whole point of governance. Because the whole point of governance is that you have given your power to somebody. So that person has to be accountable to you.

Because the local governance is so poor, that's why somebody will go into their back and then they have an issue, maybe there's a photo in the market and then they begin to call the president. And the people that are actually responsible for a can sit back, oh they can vote to Twitter, they can go to to to TikTok and call the president names and then the local government and the state of

and just sitting back, not bothered, because nobody actually knows that they are a response. So I agree with Fatai, as I said, that people, knowledge is important. So people need to know who is actually responsible. And then they need to know that they have the ones, the custodians of the power.

And they have been the custodian of the power, who you have given the power, that person is responsible to you. So being part of this country, having a part of this country form of governance where you give your power and then be an account to you.

And you know Nigeria is so large. So having one person like the prepping cause the way it looks like, now it looks like the president is the one that is governing the country all the way to the local level. That's how it feels sometimes.

I know in the States, as well you're within the States, you can feel the presence of the governor. But when it really gets bad, we start to call the president. So I really believe that we need to strengthen all of those structures.

We need to visit that issue of federalism that is really the core of what our physicians think that we should have in governance and then make it work. And I know that it's difficult, but that's something that we do need to talk about and we need to push and we need to revisit.

Thank you, Lydia. Sorry, if I can quickly talk with you. make something please. I promise it's going to be I think we've already established tonight. Maybe we need to force the star to wish that when we ourselves I reflect on the people that

we find in government because these people don't fall from air. They are the next in the entire, you know, these people are produced, they are created, they are elected, voted for by myself and you. So they don't fall from heaven.

These guys are part of us. They may not be able to speak to all the local government and NGO people. I think that's the person that speaks to I think the only faculty I really have from the audience.

I come from a game, yeah, I come from a type of guy. I know how much you get into. I know all my cancer loss. I know where they come from.

I have the amount of number. I go to my local government. I have the phone number of my local government. And I charge with the response.

I hold them accountable. You know, how many young people can actually say that they know all the states? So if we call ourselves smart intelligence,

we're building private sector companies. You know, we are doing well out there. or all the guys in God's name, those two people are ignorant and do not anything.

You, though, you're smart, but you have the number of the local government channels. Do you ever go to your local government sector and they're not there.

They're in the same way. Because we're dead. The president allocated set on a amount of money for their root to be maintained.

Why are we calling the name of the president? Why are we not calling the local government channel? You have a concern of dead, eat at concern on those jobs,

is to ensure that it's fight for you every Tuesday at the local government sector. You don't even have the number of that guy. But we are all here talking about all the...

See, the fundamental problem here is not that there's no vision. There is a clear vision. This problem is not that we don't have great people in government. I mean, more would have very bad time meaning stuff

with digital economy, Nigeria. Well, real Nigeria is it, means we have a great guy, but sometimes, I mean, it's an amazing thing that I put to you and know what he is doing today.

So, Bioso has launched an AI strategy. Because I get all say, oh, we don't have a common vision. In the tech ecosystem, we do have a common vision. We have an AI to try to do launch the development.

We have the needs done. We have needs done in the tech ecosystem. The first problem is the Langeras don't care. Langeras don't care.

They see all these things. I just told us again that the president just launched a TV program. You give four to five thousand an hour to every younger person to learn East East. You get for the 5000 era every month to learn is still.

Yes, the presidency has launched that. But you see, like, Jiren's don't care. You know what they want to do? They want to stay on Twitter.

They want to drag the president for another ETS. The same thing we did in Boris Daniel, according to Boris, did the guy who is representing the president is a clown.

That's the game we want to play. We're not actually seeing the GLS and electronic express that is fixing the country. What they want to do is to jack.

Like, you know, the look of rent is not strengthening. Excuse me. What are we supposed to really do in reality? If simple, we have a look of rent,

there's a fuck allocation. It is made for bleak, just narrows and good. I know I'll watch them into my own look of my own look of my own look of my account. I know I can tell you.

I'm going to go into my own look of my account. I can tell you. It is not because I have a superior knowledge. It's because I am interested.

I think the first thing we need to solve for is rallying, young, and curious to say you need to be interested in what happens at the local government level. There is no magic one around the state.

If there is a councilor, like I know Keto's house, I know his house, I can drive there to see a bro. It is the day I've moved to see the bad. And if he did, it shouldn't be.

I can mobilize all the younger people. I joined the WhatsApp group for one brick WhatsApp group that I've joined. I am interested in my community development. The first problem is that I'm not interested.

There is no other magical one that we are supposed to do. I just gave it like four different examples. Another one is the fact that there is now a study known for everybody that wants to go to school.

So why are young men, during still complaining that, oh, ID, this ID that, You guess what? In Legos, literally every local government shaman runs a free jam fan in Legos now. A free jam

forming Legos. So you get an opportunity to someone to pay for your jam, but the question is, are you stored in a passing the jam? So what more is the government supposed to do? There's nothing extra you can do. If you give someone the free

jam from them, you say, go write jam, but then you don't do your own part because your parent doesn't move you accountable to to say do your path. In legal state, for example, I can't speak for other states,

because I probably am not from other states. I am from legal states. I can speak to legal states. In legal states, we have a CDS.

We have CDS. But you know what those landlords do in the morning of Saturday when we say, let's have a CDS meeting, the drive past the meeting.

They stay in the under in the atoyotak ruler in their chief and the drive past and evil splash water on us that we are attending those meetings that call us new sites and say, we are jobless.

What more should we have created to bring the system? In every, I come back to that half of the people who are just called don't even know what the DPO of the younger government is.

Oh, the question is not that all. We should use all them accountable. If they do the right thing, we should not know for all that we should do the right thing

that we don't need to hold them accountable. That's the kind of point. This is what we're going to get them to do the right thing. We need to hold them accountable.

And power is never the best. that's not the way it wants. So my frustration is the fact that we are super smart and young people and we all parid ourselves

that all brilliant and smart, are we are doing well in the private, that's top of the guys and the government and doing bad ideas on this core.

Who do the names of your senators and read about them? Who be shocked the type of profile of this guy's curry? You be shocked, they are not new sense. Check the names of your commissioners.

You be shocked that where this guy's come from, some of them graduate of international universities. Like at least I may not be able to speak for many of those states, but I know my commission as in my state,

like there's no better person to gain the house of assembly meant by my own community, for example. Like the person we have in the house of assembly is super amazing in my local government,

where you cannot do anything if you have the best person for the job, but the people who don't do your accountable and all they care about is one race. Let me give you a very interesting story.

I move the life to young people in that. and we'll be like my friends and I dig in, I say guys, let us construct this bridge. And we raised the money for you to guess what those

young jobs did. The block also grew under said bridge is not the next thing that they want. That was your convert the money to rise

and distributed for them. Now think about it please for a minute. Just think about it for a minute. You are a politician.

You have the next election in front of you in the next two years. You want to do the right thing for your class, You want to build a library for your cluster, to train safe.

But the people you want to build a library for stand-up and they say they don't want the library. It wants you to convert it into rights and give them the rights to each other.

One would use you to go ahead and build a library and then you'd use the next election. See, the problem is the people, what happens to our meet that same time in Katuna,

that we built. But sometimes, any race would want it to build and make that same time. Katuna was a Katuna O'Kan, who can like us.

People, the people, people, people, people went there, they looted everything in the facility. Everything. That is not the government, that's the people. Hello, it's I. Atial. Please permit me to interrupt you. Intrepid. Most of the things, most of the things we have said are correct.

The only reason why the people can, the counter productive is because they are not aligned with the vision of the leadership. I started with everybody being aligned. That is the reason why I would look at the road that I suppose to benefit me by children,

my children, children, and then I would not see no, that is not what I want. I want to get rid of one's rice. There is no alignment. I want to make this practical. If you're president to date, how do you align people with a vision?

So that's true. And if you say, sorry, we're taking the moderate and from you. If you don't mind, if you say, open. I mean, I would like to learn to run on the back in your little bit. Okay. I'm sorry, sorry to everybody. But because I think, you know, it's policy called time. I feel like if we, if we

Can I say so? No I need to see Yes, please go ahead

I try to get tired very well and I like it Can you hear me? Can you hear me? Yes, we can hear you

Yes, we can So I think I like each day's one thing I take for this time I like his passion, I like his dedication I love his rosy names

Again, we should not look at this problem as if this problem started from today. This problem that we have right now, from years and years and years of bad governance, that led to a state-grumpy political movement on the stand, what they should be looking for. People are all thinking for immediate returns over long-term benefits, which is understandable.

So back to what we are talking about today. I think the first thing we need to do is refer to this forward, is that for example, in America, I think that the first thing you need to do, you need to make this country work.

It's for everybody's body. I'm sure it's what is clearly today. All of us are this conversation. They're ready at knowledge of a less power level of education.

They don't see it as they know. What's called the look-up of it is I think what we need to do. Is the people who can remember it stands for? If you see, if you ask an average major and what do look-up

do. The problem is saying no, I mean, why the same look can come in, it's just possible for the primary healthcare. They're responsible for the education, the didn't know. They don't know. It's only when you know that you and everybody are comfortable. I think we know that this is the same right and transparency to say that as the, yeah, what's the call? The

permission of police, this is what, yeah, this is what we should do as a DPO, this is the right, everything. So, once there's that I was called that's education. There people should know where to channel their effort. And we can start starting our accountability position. It is probably that anybody knows that this is the most. I'm told for example, the photos

of those local government people from a look and is a local government. But the question about they know that I got it came back to what each I was saying. Everybody is called to those well and in my opening remark I said today the kind of politician that we have is a product of with the people itself. I said are you with that election in this company without spending one

problem? It is not done. Even if you have the God fire and you must have spent money. So if you allow them to spend money what do we expect? We need to feed this political political system in such a way that people like a entire world passionate people would and wait and start mathematically. But the way the current air air wind lengths this way, but not entries people with genuine

trust to do. And when this is controlled, there are three, there are three fundamental tricks to do. Some, the basic needs of people's best. Let people know they are at positive, if you are giving it, if I tell you me to go my reaction on them, I'm on rate and I'm so so sure, if you're not listening to you, I just want to survive. But let me solve it by stress.

Then this is my right. Then make the political system. so free that people do not disrespect billions of dollars to get you. It's people are comfortable.

That's what I mean. You can get a lot of people out there like that, or you don't work. Because I said, I said, the money,

it gets you right now. We need to happen. And we need to solve the basic problem. We kind of shy with that basic problem.

If people still lack others, we basically will see how that problem. That is why people who does the AI's, what's going on, the tech stopping

is to take the contract to the next level. They can't think. They just feel like, no, this is what I need.

I need to eat. I cannot stop them from doing. And unfortunately, they're the numbers of those people out of the way. They are more than all the numbers already over every other person.

So we need to fix, we need to use data. So we will add the people that ask this problem. What can we do to them? Because it's the way people are okay, that they can listen to you.

If I'm hungry, if I don't have it, I'll tell you, I want to read a bridge. I'll tell you, I can't just go by the bridge, I can assume I'm ready, but just give me a good first.

We need to understand the basic problem. And we just have to have five findings, because we're just going to do routes. I'm 60 programs from the route. Anything that we are perfect or lay out in the room?

Not so bad problem. Thank you. And I think that this is the part I've done. I'll take this away with you.

Actually, everyone. OK, before you go, I want to step out. Can you hear me? So before you go quickly, I'll hear you.

First, you know, you've met me. We've spent a lot of time talking about the government. And I want us to pivot quickly to a little bit of the private sector. So for instance, like your audience in the audio time to back,

what's the areas that probably need fixing like human capital, education and so on and so forth. So what role? Okay, maybe it's a top play generally in this.

And what are you doing in your own space to actually then show that this is. So I mean I work or I can hear me. Can you hear me? Okay.

All right. So sorry. I work with the alternative bound, which is the path of the still in finisher holding onto me.

Now this is the limits path of it. So I work with the... I think only. We, I mean, everything that said is all about what we are.

So as a bank, we felt that banking is all about financial identity. It's a relationship alone. We just need to have to solve people's problem. And that is why we look at our own arts strategy,

except for else, is that for education, is that what goes on? That's what we're talking about. That's what's at the basic things that drives us here. and that's what leads us on deep, significant contribution,

and we're able to get a new application before we go to the next fall to the big side of the message that people can grab as they go to the message as they choose to as they don't arrive enough.

And for going back to the alternative feedback, which is another standard that, okay, banking doesn't have to be about borrowing and get interested in it. So you can't get a share of it.

You can't get a share of it. But it's a profit and it's a success. You don't need to do other things as conventional steps. So for the trade point, you just want to start to resolve the way in that.

In fact, people in fact like, and that's where we say that one of our, one of our players called by the way to create work, you know, which I'm saying, then, brown ways.

And that's why we want people to partner. It's a partnership with collaboration management. Because we should think that it's that partnership, it's a partnership, it's a partnership.

It's a partnership. I don't know what the government is going to be. I mean, this is our mantra. Everything that we do for me,

but if you look at our edifice, it's mentioned by the solar ice. You're not saying that you can live with the private and friends or talented reason, James.

Thank you for telling me. Thank you for telling me. Yeah, you can take it. You can call my name.

Don't explain. But I thank you for this. Thank you, John. And we can hear you for time.

Listen, before you do this. I thought we can hear you. Hello. OK, so why is why is David with some of his,

which is network issues? OK, so I'd like to just people quickly to to pressure. I know that you've gone a lot of things with regards, you know, human capital development in your space. So the question I have is the year.

Hi, Patai. Good one with your question, Fisa, I think he's That's nice, Natos. Go ahead.

Hey, sir. Can you hear me? Fatai, we can hear you. If you saw your book, we just got a question.

OK. Hey, sir. So my question to you and Kijo is just that I like to know what do you see to be the policies and innovations

that can close the global urban education gap? I know you've worked with a lot of partners in this regard. And what are the some of the things that that's the identified or that you've identified

as being a challenge. And what would you say it would take to work in terms of just the immacaptor development of Nigerians and particularly

which would cause education because we see a lot of Nigerians live having to leave the country now to be able to actually thrive in this regard. I'm sorry.

I'm sorry. I'm sorry. So I was muted for a bit. So if I get your question correctly, you want to know what we need to do to close the human

capital development gap in Nigeria. Correct.

Episode 08
Education

The Cost of Learning

A frank conversation on school costs, family pressure, and what can make quality education feel less out of reach.

01:08:00 Education Open on X
Open full transcript

Good evening ladies and gentlemen. It is we great pleasure that I welcome you to As second in the series of our work wisdom Seriously Today we would be discussing the cost of learning

Is education out of reach for many Nigerians We hope that you would find this session very useful and hope that you will learn a lot from this conversation. Please give me a thumbs up if you can hear me very clearly. Thank you.

Thank you. Thank you very much. Once again it's so nice to have you here. We have us because I will be introducing them shortly. Like I said, I hope that you will learn greatly from this session and we hope and look forward to making it very interactive. Great. So I would introduce our panelists or speakers shortly.

I would start off with, before I, before I do this, because I would start off with, you know, giving a context and a background to the conversation that we would be having today. Education is something that, you know, should be at, you know, at the, the head of everyone. No one should be as to there from being educated, especially from our education.

Over the past years, we have seen tremendous increase in the cost of education from tuition fees to live in expenses for students and likes. I would reload some data that is available in the public space. And this starts from the public investors, which most of us would be very familiar with.

Public investors have seen an increase in tuition fees ranging from 58,000 to about 167,000 annually. Private investors on the other hand have become people more expensive. They currently charge between 900,000 to about 1.2 million in a year. And this is according to take about narrow metrics on the other hand, gives a spotlight on private secondary schools.

And it's recent report. It says that two Sean fees are private secondary schools have searched with some charging as much as 4.7 million annually making high quality education and archa-bi-rich for many families. In all of these, inflation continues to drive up

the costs of goods and services, affecting students' abilities, to afford to show fees, accommodation, textbooks and other expenses.

Now let's look at what the government is doing in this space. In our 2025 budget, in a drug government allocated 3.5 to 3 million

to the education sector. And this is does 7.3% of the total national budget of, excuse me, of 49.7 trillion. Although this allocation marks a slight increase

from what it was in 2024, which was 1.51 trillion. It higher by remains significantly below the UNESCO recommendation of 15 to 20%.

And even in our own policy guideline for sustainable educational development, it is captured as 26%. Notably the 2025 budget includes 806.9 billion, which has been a month specifically for infrastructure development in the sector.

And compassing all initiatives like the Invasa Basic Education program and the establishment of nine new higher educational institutions. Despite these allocations, stakeholders have expressed consent that the funding is insufficient

for addressing multifaceted challenges facing the education system, including inequity for structure, our data, curricula, and the high number of out of school children.

Why the 2025, education body reflects a modest increase? is still first very short of the recommended benchmarks. To help us dissect and review all of this, we have three scholarly individuals

who today would be speaking to this topic, the cost of learning is education out of reach for many Nigerians. It's an honor to introduce our first speaker, Godufa,

and all over. She is an experienced digital librarian at the Alliance from SAIL Legos specializing in information management, digital archiving and cultural resource access. She leads initiatives to promote digital literacy and cultural preservation including

the digitizing archival materials and curating literary events. Odufah mentors, imagine authors and first as a strong reading culture. As a member of the Nigerian Library Association

and International Federation of Library Association, she contributes to global library division and cultural heritage preservation efforts. Please, let's give a warm round of applause

as welcome her to this ex space session. Next is engineer Duu Juboku. He's a PhD holder in engineering and also an educational leader. He's PhDs in chemical engineering with expertise

in petroleum engineering. He serves as a director at Taidob College and Larrick and International College. Both of these institutions are in a bucota

and the burden respectively. and in his role as director of this secondary institutions, he focuses on academic excellence and career readiness programs. He is also the chairman of the Abayomie Ulu Atosin Juboku Foundation where he champions scholarships and educational empowerment for underprivileged students.

He has received national awards for educational excellence and community development. Please, let's give him a warm round of applause as welcome him to this Ex-Pace session. Last but not least, is Alex Zema. He is a product manager and a finisher in crucial networkets. They put on manager the alternative bank, focusing on educational and

vocational finance, consumer education and financial literacy. With over two years of experience, he develops business solutions that enhance access to quality education and financial services and powering communities through financial inclusion. Alex is fascinated by creating impactful products and values, family and community support. Please let's give Alex a very warm roundabout

applause as welcome him to this ex space. Thank you. Thank you very much. We would dive in immediately into our conversation.

But before we do so, I want to use your opportunity to mention that in the course of the conversation, if you do have questions, please do use the bottles on your phone or your laptop.

There's a way you can indicate to get the attention of the host and the co-host who would give you the opportunity to speak. Let's make this a very engaging session. As I speak as speak, you can please move out to note your questions

and that the appropriate time is in the kit to engage. Thank you very much. So yes,

I've been straight into the conversation. My first question would be to engineer Edo. And my question to you is from your experience as a director in two secondary school education institutions.

How has the rights and education costs, protect students and their families? What do you think needs to be done to ensure education remains affordable, especially for lower income families? Thank you very much, you have a wonderful thing, you have a lot of speak, I'm not speaking of this text platform.

I'm not saying it's a nice to hear this platform to show my thoughts on this particular topic. So I'm asking a question on speech earlier. I'll not just ask my opinion.

Now for that issue of education is a function of the class of people we're talking about. And you learn about the recognition of the data, what are the low income families?

If you use the perception of the high-pens, the society, and the high income fund is the safety of the high-class society, to look at affordability. It might not be getting the rare perspective.

Because such people in society need to absorb any type of education. It won't be the reason that it's not even in the area, it won't let us outside the phones

of this country. Now, the mid-income highness of the middle class will also be able to afford some kind of education, depending on their pockets,

when they go for one or six or probably the people or the family that will fill in the moves, at the low-income highness. Who makes up the majority of the people in the society?

we cannot afford this type of education or let's say cannot have a full-speed education. So what would probably be my role, probably the effect on the effort of the ability

of education at this particular point in time? You probably observe. I mean, from our own experience, what I've seen is that by the time you put your field, it's a bit hot

because of the rising cost of, I mean, maybe operational cost or maybe cost of PMS, it also gives us a reason from about what it was, about 150 or 200 or about 900 now,

or because of the rising cost of the food items, food inflation. Now by the time we are up to our just two-shone fields, because of all these.

I mean, the first thing that I mean, that I have, seeing that I have observed is that you have water to a tree of more families of a large drop of from the institution.

And that's it. It leads to a more drop out of a city from this group. Now it teaches that some are dropping off. Some are coming from.

So those who cannot afford the very high walls before, who was also going to use the other one high walls at the lower one that can afford to come start. So, I assume, go help.

Some of them are coming. So, in parallel, one thing I come from, I think there's a drop in the number of affordability for that particular type of education.

I must also say that by the time we are doing this, I mean, it also has some effect on the students themselves and on the family. I mean, I saw this thing for example,

but it teacher brought to me sometimes that when I was saying that he observed that she has lost some level of concentration and class. And what was the reason for this?

But then interacting with his students, he said my father has four wives. And he said that now this school has increased the tuition fees that now she's not only child

and she's not sure that she can afford the father can afford those fees again. So you see, this as a factor in family, because it brings more body into the family.

And of course, even the students, themselves, also as an effect on them because psychologically, we intercede students, we cannot concentrate, especially when the student has passion for that school.

And for us, it's a lot sponsored by you. They probably have to begin to see a case when the student begins to have some psychological disturbance or even to learn.

recoverable and machine plus an even range of issues. Pulled out of that system. You probably might describe that that student's method. Not even being able to concentrate on my effect.

I didn't do it quite adaptive to value in school. That's it. It has to be taken to. So the press of letting becomes the big cost for the student.

There is volume for the part of the parents. More financial volume in part of the parents. And I suppose that it will access to policy education becomes more challenging.

Because by the time you increase the institution, of course, some people don't want to follow and go for lesser quality education. And I'm also seeing that the fact that some people are going

for lesser quality, lesser school, that has less up is not mean that the quality of education will have to actually fall. Sometimes the fees that you pay does not equal it to quality.

sometimes I say the fees that you pay does not equate to quality and sometimes you can also have very good education by paying the higher fees. So I think to ask a question, I mean it's taking me too. If you take it too long if family, you take it too long a student and in fact it will also take it too long a institution itself because you might be losing some of your very bright and very

good students to some of that systems which are not going to give them as good quality as to your profile. Thank you very much. Thank you very much, and I do for your introductory comments and response to that question. But I would I would want you to speak more to that problem.

From your experience, also as a philanthropic individual. I mean, you share a foundation. What are the things that you have noticed in the society?

because there's also sometimes an interest, the lack of interest. I mean, I have seen situations where some states have declared, you know, free education, you know,

for certain level, you know, of children to school and to gain for my education for free. But there are still, you know, there are still incidences where, you know,

the children are not in school, you know. What would you, would that be a function of cost or idea of that issues that are related to that? Because in that situation, you know, it's something that is totally different from cost. What do you think will change that?

You see, this idea we have now, students and themselves needs to be challenged. I am a different motivation for these students now at this. You see, I look at some of the things that happened within our space in society. And I see that there are more factors encouraging students to go out of school space that

more encourage them to be in school. Now I'll say, sharing sometimes a good look at some TV reality issues that give us more such as the millions of narratives, people who do not go and spend some days in the Pazupura, in the East, and the Comata, for some time.

And such bodies are sponsored, such things don't even have so much of a concern for educationally-client programs. You see students that come best in the academic and their voice in universities, in secondary schools, or even in

competitions, except for research. When we start seeing some people doing something very interesting, you see them giving them very mega, some of them, very mature months.

And see people who are doing things that are not even educational and getting a huge amount of money for all of these things. So we will begin to look at these things.

It was not even encouraged the lending process on a part of students. You know, very see that education is in spam. Just not, I mean, education is the only instrument

that can emissive pet anybody. It looks like it is not pain of because many will have invested so much money to it. And at the end of the day, you are seeing

like you're not even getting so much from it in spam. So it gets in the moods job at the end of the day after you have spent so much in education. what in its real sense is not you have not you have not

got a lot of them in form of education. The only things that go into education. You know, let me say. Yes, I will clean.

So I think I struck them in may have. I know, thank you. I would say in the conversation, so do you have any contributions to what I think

I do was speaking about. Yes, I do. Good evening, everyone. Hello, good evening, everyone. Please confirm you could hear me. Do you want to hear me?

Yes, I can hear you. Okay, Alex, can you hear me? Yeah, we can hear you, Don. I guess you can hear us. Can you hear me?

Okay. So, Alex, if you can hear me, please. is to share your thoughts on what engineer do what's speaking about. Hello, don't.

Can you hear me? Hello. Can you hear me, also? Good evening, everybody.

I think the motor into us currently have issues. So I'll go back to engineer do. Please, we can hear you.

I'll put it forward. Oh, sorry. If we brought to my notice that I seem to be the one with the network shall range.

So please, yeah, engineer, I do it. You please, you can change it. OK, so I was just saying that some of these students needs to be encouraged themselves by some of the things

we say around them. and the requirements passed from individuals, organizations, make insurance whenever there is a position in demand for the glitch of this significant hit me clearly.

Yes, I think I can hear you. Please continue. Oh, okay. So I just feel that there should be more that should be done in terms of

of the importance to them. So that they don't just see that whatever effort you are putting into education is not rewarded appropriately. I've seen cases where some of the things that are done excellent to develop in particular end levels, academic end levels. And you see they give you some games, some mega amounts of money. And you see there's really no even

perform, well, not many who have done some of that things and they have been as some little worried. So some of these issues are what's considered to be and makes students feel discouraged about the issue of a going to education. And I think that the street policy is when it comes to

education, at least every student or every child, sure, or at least It's very, very important. It's not like we want to see what happens where students should be normally in school, and they are both doing about talking and being heard of, and that's in street policies

on that. That between normal school time, not to them, there are no child who will find outside. do you any thing that's not related to formal education? So I think if these policies are put into place,

it will also help students to know that our systems are quite a basic education, then our students to most themselves having good idea of what they want to be.

A clear vision and clear understanding that they can also be more to ask for leads. and friendly individuals, organizations should move as so much as they can. So according to further analysis, the education has something that is not just a distant

fire or something that we can get there, it was from almost completely or maybe sometimes soon whenever they do well in any events or any institution. That's my contribution. Thank you. Thank you very much, engineer, do, CCR apologies, network, but I'm back. And thank you for holding on the conversation.

Although I missed, you know, part of the response, but I do get the sense of, you know, the angles that you touched on. And I want to progress the conversation by asking not to far. How has digital literacy impacted access to education, especially in rural areas

as well as engineer who mentioned there is the issue of financing and family dynamics, you know, which is a lot more pronounced in those regions. What role do libraries and data platforms play in region this, this gap in terms of financing in education? All right, thank you, Dan, for that question. Good evening everyone. And thanks to alternative

banking for using this platform, maintaining all due protocol. Thank you, engineer Duwau. That was quite insightful. And did you talk platform and what the library has done

so as making a lot of this better? Whether you like it or not, it's not just the river here as that so far is one of the challenges. Both the era and home by era people so far.

And if you look at the cost of data and data is not cheap. However, digital resource and literacy can be simplified in the sense that making it accessible online. So it can be whole line or it can be offline.

However, the ones the students are using, but the library as an organization or as a segment or as a ministry and an engineer, they've created a lot of digital resources that makes its students learning easy for them in the sense that they have a lot of offline activities they can do. There are some hub that you use that doesn't require data. You use them

of data and that's where you insist students learning scale. So some libraries here in legal are used in legal as an instance. We have public-private libraries in legal. There are some private libraries in legal as a media library free, more or less, very affordable in the sense that everyone have access to the library and there are systems in each of these libraries.

And the answers of this system is to make many easy for them. But one question we should answer myself. Are these students aware? Yes.

As students aware of such information, yeah, labels. Let's use the linkers as an instance idea aware. And people do their aware, are they interested? So just like engineer dewisted, I think they have a lot of distractions more

compared to the distractions, to compare to the ones and curating the more answers to use the better parts of digitalization of education. So one of the things libraries we can also do, there's a segment of education that's a particular application of knowledge in the sense that we make knowledge forms for students

while reading in the sense that they are so-and-half that they might be playing, but not to the learning from it. So it's not just a challenge faced by the right area. is it a interest for everyone in Nigeria? We know that the cost of detail is not cheap.

And if there's no data, the lights, these are the photos that they use. If there's no lights, they say that data. So this is what the challenge is. Thank you so much, Madam Farf, for your response. But I mean, beyond just the issue of data, What are the strategies from your perspective that give you experience that you have found

most effective in engaging young, Nigerian, in literacy and education. We only come to digital learning platforms. I know you talked about the challenges around it, but is there any green light of hope in that space and how well has it impacted your engagement?

Okay, there's green lights. So yes, I will say there's green lights and the green lights the voice dance or gamification. What are you like?

It's one of the easiest way for you to cultivate this young head that's how young Nigeria is through digital platform. You understand? And those digital platforms, therefore we already know that

know that when first they're going to be on the phone probably we need to make more help that make learning for them and the school are going back to the school methods we need to make it an individual learning of school. I would want to say 60% of the schools in Nigeria lack or individual learning of school. I consider in the fact that everyone have the

learning method or learning like this. They are from children and learn faster or perform faster when they use your Jovidra method or Jovidra is the TV and the other things that they use in teaching your children so no more using writing on the child board they're a bad spot. Using this system of teaching can make it better and gamification, the gamification can be

as basic as board games. Using a board game to narrate what the need to learn for matrices for anything you want to learn. So gamification is one of the key ways we could make all of this data, then aside gamification or to visualise through, then aside or to visualise in everything on the phone and making it easy and better for them. I think that's one of the key ways they can

learn. Thank you, Autofar, but yeah, I have you said gamification, digitisation, you know, and all or the visual elements. I want to believe that all of those are to do, to this conversation we're talking about

the cost of lending. Because like I read out in the previous infrastructure that is needed to support lending these days is a lot more expensive.

Given the fact that there's not a lot of resources, I mean, look at the budget that we have, just about 7.something percent of the national projects. Alex, what do you think, you know, or how do you think, you know, this whole funding for this sector? I'm some of the things that are the first

put through gamification or the video materials, you know, to help learning. How are there any innovative ways that this can be put in place. All right, thank you very much. Good evening, everybody. Good evening, listeners. Thank you so much for having me.

I think people would really gravitate towards the area of need or web as well as that particular need. So as if I not try to situation, we can innovate ourselves to

So for seeing not just the students, but also the schools by making funding available for IDADA needs, the education needs for the school for instance, she mentioned the audio visual strategy. Now, like she mentioned, most schools have been really adopted this particular strategy and it's something that might be

maybe based on the cost for instance. Now, making funding available for schools like this can really help this school, help the students. In fact, it's just like a win-win situation

for everybody at the end of today. Financial institutions can go into partnership with schools and vocational institutions to make sure that accessibility of education can be gotten either

true flexible payment options like I mentioned. So they are making fun in availability before these people, giving them flexible payments plans and affordable rates,

so that it's not really so pressing to the parents or to the school. So either increase the cost of education as the case may be.

Thank you very much. Thank you Alex for that insight and and provable solutions to the challenge around the cost of developing all of these materials,

lending materials that are required. We have been receiving some questions in our chat, please. If you have any questions to ask, you can add our drop them in the chat or indicates

to speak and we will have the opportunity. We have a question here that says, with the rising cost of education, how do schools cope with increasing number of dropouts

and drop-offs because of affordability issue. This question has been directed to a GNA do. In addition to that, we have says, do schools partner with

and links to them to finance, yes? And in order to you. Okay, thank you very much. I have a school school with the financial demands

when you have drop-offs from the school. And I think to be honest with you, one of the most challenging periods during business is now. Because you have to only see the attitude and look at

what your plans have and plan effectively If you cannot increase to show fees over both, they have to block the tickets. You have to look at places where

on necessary funds are going to, and it's going to block it. So I'm going to say that one thing that you're going to do is to foresee them, go back to your activity.

This is only time to spend on things that are not necessary. And those because what are the things that are very important for you to do to actualize, know you feel the world that's times and what's as easy as before. So you cannot afford your increased tuition or family to plan out for the increased tuition.

Of course you'll go about. And like I said before, some who are also coming from very high-end peace, who is also coming. So it's like, I mean, you're having it coming out, going out and coming in. But even at that, you still need to be able to sit down and a good plan,

look at your printing cost, we are trying to put down, cut down in a manner that not affect the quality that we are delivering. I've seen through, I've seen the number of institutions I was saying, because now there is a surge in the cost of papers.

I know I used to know that a cut on an E4 paper is 5,000 paper in there in so one or two years back. 5,000 paper in there. Now a cut on an E4 paper is 20,000. And the most rational thing for anybody to want to do is to say,

look, if I was setting my questions using five sheets of papers before, for an auto-party to two. But for a system that's a for size of the quality delivery and quality certification,

that may not be a part I want to take. We seem want to make sure that you maintain quality. What you may look at areas of transport to me, you can also put down on the consumption of fuel,

or some areas where you can also put down on some of the consumption of diesel or as a case, maybe, but not primarily cutting down the number of teachers so that you don't end up giving education

that there's no point to. So, to try to ask a question on somebody, I would just say that we have to sit down and tell me, we have to calm down, we have to be able to climb very well,

we have to remove excessive cost, up on block leakages and you need to be at the end of our phase so that you don't give your own information that is not useful. Thank you. Thank you, Magna. Just to narrow down your response. I think the

person has a question, you know, also want to know if as an institution, right? If you if you know it is part of your policy, unless you see a student that has challenges, do you recommend or do you lead students

to potential finance yet? Well, one thing we do is that when we observe that is a particular student, for example, as very good, a progressive prospects,

this could take upon itself to give some more scholarship. Then another thing we do is that we have foundations which are linked to host students. Some foundations also take responsibility of certain students. We have about three or four foundations.

We also need to do school and reduce foundations, take responsibilities for students to the O.K. This particular student is in the gente and is financially under cover this movement. We have also this foundation, please contact them and I'm willing to work with you, or since they work with you, we're willing to take us more of this financial body of you too.

So we are about two or three of them that are working with you. That we can easily recommend them to. And of course, this also has its own internal foundation scheme, where you also make sure that some of the indigencies of students or some of these financials are looking at the

I also get that. Thank you so much, Major. I do. I do have another question from you from our chat.

And if you don't mind, I will ask this quickly. So we get the conversation going. The question is, you know, we know that government is intervening. By providing access, you know, performing through the Nigerian

Iran education loan phone, Nelphone, as well as credit core. From your experience running, you know, been a director in two secondary institutions, have this been impactful? Have you begun to feel the positive impact of these initiatives by the government?

Okay. So I think the Najra and the special loan fund, Nelphone, primarily is meant for the universities. I mean, it's not an initiative that has been extended to the step on the schools. And it's a primary room for universities. And that's I think the only trend for replicates what has been happening in order to develop the countries of the world-west students can

take a long interest long than they can use it for schooling. And after they are finished with schooling. After three years ago, about the beginning to pay back to the body, which was given that look. And after three years ago, we have not also got seen a model called it a job. You probably write a letter to also extend some of these things. So this no-for-thing, I think,

is primarily meant for universities. I know this because I also take a lawsuit due to some and lecture and that's about a lot of investing in the panel company and we're seeing some students that's a really neat small opportunities but only if we are with no funds is corruption and that's just the truth and there's a lot I mean those who are the ability news for the world now

are both of the persons who can see them do they have come out to speak against other these issues but I feel that that will probably be one of the major issues that that body may have to do with as an example. So the intervention from New York Fund is primarily for universities and it's for public universities, states and for the universities not for any private institutions.

Amazing. Thank you. Amazing. Thank you so much for those clarifications inside into how NERFON operates and the challenges within that space. Coming over to ULAX, you just had the concerns that engineer D'Oun mentioned about the challenge around NERFON and the war is around corruption.

What can private institutions, especially within the financial sector, How can this step in to plug this, you know, this, this, this gap? Because I know that, you may thumbs up, you can hear me. Thank you.

Alice, can you hear me? I can hear you by a lot of you for a bit. Okay. So I was saying that given the context that mentioned, I do mentioned, how can financial institutions,

or even the brother, private sector. How can this tap in terms of financing these? I was gonna reference some private entities in the developed countries that are responsible for loans

to students. We see a lot of some of their ad bans that say, you don't need cosignies, people to sign up in support for you. You can just get a loan in an

go to school. How can the private sector, especially within the financial space, you know, bridge, discover, discover, discover, discover, and the consensus that engineering, do you mention about their fund? All right, thank you very much. Like I mentioned earlier, it's just to make

fund in available and another thing we need to look out for is educating people to know that these funds are valuable. Some people would want to pay out of pockets, regardless of how bad their financial situation is.

So we need to make it loud over there to make sure people are well-defact that. They can walk up to financial institutions and get funding for this particular need.

If you're trying to go to school, across all level of education, with our primary schools for parents who have children in primary or secondary school, funding is available.

So you can reach out to financial institutions who have fully developed and innovative to the point where they can strategically put out products and partnership opportunities that would make access

to education very, very easy for both parents and much of students. So if you're trying to go for your masters, it can actually have a product for you.

All you need to do is provide the necessary documentation and then funding is made available and then you can go for your masters and while you're going for your masters,

pay conveniently with flexible payment plans. And also, like I mentioned earlier, financial institutions too can make sure that this funds are valuable and accessible

and that the rates are very, very affordable. I made mention earlier that people would only want to gravitate towards people or institutions that solve their personality.

And I feel if this personality is of individuals because a lot of families are suffering because of this education is important. It's important for people to go to school

And they don't need to sacrifice so much to go to school. We can make it easy for them and make a win-win situation for Buddhist schools who would be at the verge of almost losing out on students because of the cost.

And then for parents who may have their children or their words, drop out of school because of lack of funds. Thank you very much. Thank you so much Alex.

I do like the parts that you said that the fonts are available to both people. Do not know about them. For me, what I bring to mind is that there's

a challenge around financial education. If that is a major challenge and giving your experience as someone who has walked in that space, What's, how can financial literacy?

How can the information around the ability of finances, you know, we made a lot more, you know, known to people from your experience. All right, thank you very much.

I know you're getting questions. Yes, I guess. Thank you very much. Financial literacy is very important.

helps individuals understand their finances better, it helps them plan properly. You know, it helps them even understand their spending habits and also suggest better ways and opportunities that they can

adopt. And you also get them prepared for all the unforeseen circumstances like increase or implement in school fees, I think we meant in, let's say,

body-infused cost of transportation for the students and the lives. So with financial literacy, people are well informed about the availability of products

and some strategies by financial institutions that can be available to the public that they can actually buy into and make the cost of education easy for them.

Like, we can still, you know, If I nationalize, I mean, to the consumer education of financial literacy, they can understand budgeting, they can understand savings, targeted towards education. And once your savings and your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your, your target savings is

not up to par, is still funding. You can access financing from financial institutions without breaking the bank, without, without, without so much burden on your thought. Thank you very Thank you so much Alex. I would love to get the perspective of Udufa. Alex has spoken about ability or forms. He has talked about creating awareness that these forms are available.

And in fact, can you help us with your understanding of your view around what kind of collaboration and you think we're moving powerful and creating more accessible educational resources for Nigerians, especially within the digital space? What type of collaborations do you think would help the system thrive?

Well, we'll do phase responding to that. If you have questions, please drop your questions in the chat. We are also looking out for your raise hands. If you have questions for any of us because we'll talk about you.

Mary, thank you so much for that question. Whenever we get to talk about collaboration, the fastest we all look at for its governments. And this is just to change the narrative. Collaboration can be within two or more companies.

Can be within banks, can be within tech companies and their about. So we should not look at just the government alone. And the collaboration starts from me and you understand where we give the major tax to the government.

We can start collaborating by our own self. starting a book club leading or over in tiny in a school where you know that you don't have property chairs. If you go to, if you go to NYS in that, if you see that it copies via unsight and you got me school, the quick thing they get to do is that let's get to rejection

into. I don't want to say it here, but that's one of the things you can do to collaborate and make sure that quality education is of the rich because you judge but it's ahead and of being on the report of the recent rate in education. So collaborations within tech companies to make sure that their digital resources is affordable.

We could get offline digital help that we could use with our data and the rest through and see the children, what digital resources is all about as much as we speak about digital resources and what not of digital resources. They see like a major barrier of children not understanding what digital literacy is all about.

Just like the way we have the financial literacy, the efficiency, the same way we have that digital literacy deficiencies. So I feel first of all we need to create an awareness on all of these. There's a saying that says that it's what you know you would see to the other teachers

that don't know how to use system. So if a teacher does not know how to use the lab, how will E or she be able to pass such information to students how I should be able to use such tools. So the awareness needs to start this before we look

at the collaboration, book elaboration starts with every individual's involved. We'll do time in different NGOs, whether it's paid or not, rendering your service, starting a book club,

starting a reading habit, starting a reading competition, just like engineer Adou said from the onset. We have so many activities that are formed. But that means not relating to education.

But when it comes to education, you barely see a font for it. You see a child who tells you, it tells you, right, my essay for 10,000 words. And the first one, I will of course, the 10,000 error.

With this, you are killing the vibe of that. But when it comes to the ask of this, and you see that the child is very known with a plasma TV, this is a thing that we as individual,

we need to be heart-bound during. We should breathe of our self-for-reach, anything that you come, anytime you come across the chat,

don't something where academicity supports that. That's the way we can fast-indecolaboration. Why we wait for the bigger ones to come. Wow, wow. Thank you so much, Dufa. You really touched on something that, you know, struck it hard, you know, with me. I've always wondered if I was the only one that had, you know, that perception that

anything education doesn't get the commercial rich reward. So yeah, you have, you know, really take on that to the front bonner. I think it's something that it would be government should look at.

I mean, you see a lot of people graduating with first class and all they get is handshake and maybe 50,000 are paid out of water or something. It's really something that should be looked into.

Thank you so much, Jennifer. I have loads of questions rolling in from a listeners. There's a question for you and Gnae do. And the question is that you mentioned

that expensive education does it equal to quality education. As a parent in Nigeria, how can you get the best value for your kids? Okay, thank you very much.

And I will emphasize that that's expense education or the amount of money you're paying. does not equate to the depth or the quality of education that you get. You only need to be very investigative.

What you are about to choose a child is a scooter or child. I mean, there are factors you need to look at. Look at the track record of those schools. Now, we are looking at track record.

You are not also looking at how many is the making wide, or how many is the making network. That's those are good parameters to check on But sometimes they are not the exhaustive parameters to use to determine your school child. Who is here?

Well, the child is going to your school. Yeah academic needs the child needs to give the ask to be met There are moral needs that should be met and I think for example the moral needs are important as academic needs for the child So if you are going to school that they are paying, everybody knows what it wants for its child.

I mean somebody that pays some good or high millions of narrow-four secondary education, those don't mean that it's not getting quality education. Or of course it could get quality education,

but that does not also mean that those who are paying something lesser and not also getting same quality education. I have several examples that if you come to an institution around here, for example, some of our experts, every international example that needs to be written in any international

community, mentioned it's agency, mentioned it, can be written, mentioned it, I am out here, mentioned it, checkpoint, your entity, I will have to break the banks to make sure that you get that quality of the mission. The most important thing to book after,

is that you have buildings and all these schools. Your buildings are part of the infrastructures that you create a conducive environment for the children. What is common out of those buildings?

It's a function of those quality teachers that you are putting in place. And of course, getting put on is not mean that. They're going to be peanuts today.

They're going to have to be able to pay them well. So that you can also be able to, we also have to chat with us council pay them. But at the same time, you have to charge commercialically. You have to charge

them with that. You have to target audience in mind that I want my education or I want my school to be affordable. Whether you have a high class or a middle class, and even if you look at the classroom, it will be a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a little bit of a face. So these are the things I want to put in mind. But how do you know? We school to take a

they need to be investigative. I tell you, you need to be very investigative. You need to ask questions for people who have passed personal discourse before, and they may be privileged to give you

better experiences of what is coming up. Many schools are not what they're going to be until you get in. That is when you understand what many schools are doing. To get results, or what they are doing to make sure that your

children are even getting the right morals for the wrong moral. So for me, if you are going to get quality education, it is not about how high you can pay. How high you can pay can give you and most are typically not giving you. But most of the time, you will score that student who are even doing very, very well,

and not do something. Or if you are going to the schools where they are paying more to the owners of their own. They are those who go to the schools where they can afford to get disciplined, the ones who go to the schools,

where they can afford to lend the right norms of how to deal with life and decisions of life. I'm most importantly, they are those who are able to get academic independence.

You don't depend on anybody academicity, and of course, you'll get a little more in life. So that's my, that's my son. That's amazing, amazing.

Thank you so much. you said something that caught my attention. And you said the moron needs as important as the academic needs for a child.

There's no stronger way to balance it. We have the question here from one of our listeners who says, I think it'd be your own traditional education. Vocational education and skill acquisition trainings

are also getting expensive. Is there anyone looking in this direction in terms of funding? Once again, as you know, I think you would help us

do justice to this because your resume does show that a tie dog and a lary can, you have walked into great vocational training with academics. How has this approach helps your students in terms of employability and financial independence

to not only support themselves but their family. I know the flip side in responding to the question from the listener, is any entity looking at the direction of funding vocational studies? I'm sorry, my network was cracking anyways.

I think I really didn't get a question. It's got a comment. OK, so the question that was asked is that beyond traditional education, vocational education and skill

acquisition training is also getting expensive, right? From there, I mentioned that your experience are tied up and Larry can, you know, has also shown, you know, there is that effort that you have put in, you know, in your work to integrate vocational training with academics.

So my question is to is to prompt how has the integration of vocational training into academics helps your students in terms of ability and financial independence on the one hand and on the second hand given the rising cost of vocational training as QSAC position training. Is there anybody, is there any corporate entity or organ of government, even within the NGO space that is looking

in the direction of funding those activities? Okay thank you very much. I think the way to to go now is to build most of the ability for students. Because we can tell which one we are for them when they are like I tell small them.

As a look at most of the instructors that teach you are many of them ready for top graph. I'm many of them great graphics and web design. I'm many of them ready to teach you.

You've obviously read other courses in university. And at some point in time, you have to gravitate towards some of these skills that they are now teaching you today. So it is also good to empower each other with

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Abubakar Muhammad Musa

Summary

Abubakar Muhammad Musa is currently a Sharia Advisor and Consultant for SHAPE Knowledge Services a consulting firm based in Kuwait. He has been involved in product development, Sharia research and approval of Islamic banking products for different clients. His work covers retail banking, corporate banking and project finance deals.

Formerly, Abubakar worked as a Researcher in different units at International Shariah Research Academy for Islamic Finance (ISRA) in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. Besides his primary assignments in ISRA, he taught Shariah Rules in Financial Transactions to Chartered Islamic Finance Professional (CIFP) Masters online Students of International Centre for Education in Islamic Finance (INCEIF), Malaysia. He also taught MBA and BBA Students different Islamic Banking and Finance Subjects at University College of Bahrain.

Abubakar holds two Diplomas with distinction, one in Islamic Law and the other in Arabic Language from Al-Imam University Riyadh. He also holds LLB (Hons) degree in Shariah from the same University. He successfully completed his (CIFP) Professional Masters Degree Programme at (INCEIF), Malaysia. He had his internship program on Islamic Banking & Finance at Fajr Capital in Kuala Lumpur. During the programme, Abubakar conducted research relating to product structuring and market development.

Abdurraheem Ahmad Sayi

Summary

Abdurraheem Ahmad Sayi is a legal practitioner and Consultant of over 16 years of active legal practice. He is currently the principal partner, A.A. Sayi & Co. (Qist Chambers) and Qadi, Independent Shari’ah Panel of Lagos State – a platform, through which he has delivered several judgments of in-depth analysis, widely applauded by leading legal and intellectual icons, including learned Judges, professors of law and Islamic Studies.

He is the Executive Director/C.E.O., ClearPath Islamic Centre (Incorporated), Lekki-Lagos and Chief Imam, SilverPoint Central Mosque, Badore, Ajah-Lagos. Fondly called Imam Sayi, Abdurraheem is the designate Chairman, Shari’ah Advisory Committee, Mutual Benefit Takaaful.

Imam Sayi has also authored a few works, some of which include: The Financial Obligations: a compendium of essays on monetary or material obligations under Islamic Law and Waqf (Charity Endowment): The Governing Principles.

He holds a Certificate on Improving Personal Effectiveness from the Lagos Business School (Pan African University) and he is a recipient of numerous awards and certificates of merits.

Abdulkader Thomas

Education:

Master of Arts Law and Diplomacy, The Fletcher School of Law & Diplomacy.

Bachelor of Arts Arabic & Islamic Studies, The University of Chicago.

Shariah Board Experience:

Bank Muscat Meethaq (2013 – 2017)

Sterling Bank Nigeria (Since 2013)

University Bank, USA (Since 2006)

Summary

Abdulkader Thomas has over 35 years of diversified financial services experience in major markets. With a Master of Arts Law and Diplomacy from The Fletcher School of Law & Diplomacy and a BA in Arabic & Islamic Studies from The University of Chicago. His areas of activity have included trade finance, real estate finance, securities and alternative finance.

As the general manager of a foreign bank branch in New York, he secured the first US regulatory approvals of Islamic mortgage and instalment credit/sale as banking instruments. Later, he secured US regulatory approval for profit sharing deposits. Abdulkader has been involved in the successful implementation of these products in the US market. With more than 17years Shariah Board Experience in Bank Muscat Meethaq, Sterling Bank Nigeria and University Bank USA, Abdulkader has worked on IFTA projects in Europe, Africa, Southeast Asia, and an authority on Islamic deal structures and securities.

He also serves as a director of Alkhabeer Capital in Jeddah and Chairman of Alkhabeer (DIFC). He is a member of the international advisory board of the Securities Commission of Malaysia, a published author, and an active speaker on Islamic finance.